Effort required to steer early Super Stalker without power assisted steering?

[preventec47]

I test drove a Stalker on Hemmings auctions  yesterday and found the driving to be unpleasant due to the effort to turn the steering wheel.   I realize there are gear ratios and geometries involved with the steering boxes and connections to the spindles.... so it is possible to change the ratios or geometries of steering systems to get less wheel movement per movement of the steering wheel ?  You wouldnt think a 1600ish pound vehicle could take much effort to steer but I think that the increased difficulty to steer could affect the quickness of recovery from a power slide for instance.     I believe this is one of the reasons the owner is selling the car as he has acquired other sports cars to do his recreational driving in since he acquired the SuperStalker. Could the  steering components used also be from the Chevy S-10 pickup?  

[Croc]

 

Steering racks on the Stalkers were more of a personal preference type of thing.  I have heard of S10, Volvo, after market custom, etc steering being used on Stalkers.  

 

I looked at the photos of the car and think your steering effort is likely because it looks to be a 11 inch or 12 inch steering wheel.  If that has been combined with a quick ratio steering rack then it will be worse again.  Even a Caterham has heavy steering at slow speeds with a small steering wheel.  If you mount a bigger steering wheel then the effort is reduced.  

 

There are set up options to consider as well.  You can reduce toe to improve turn in responsiveness.  Any car thats new to you should get a full wheel alignment to check the set up.  

 

[Anaximander]

The steering rack is definitely S-10! That is why Stalker on their M-Spec cars went to Coleman racing steering racks that have ratio adjustable guts. Additionally, on most new M-Spec cars, Scott uses a proportional steering power assist that make steering wonderful even at walking pace speeds. As Croc pointed out, some track enthusiasts in Stalkers like the XL prefer not to have the steering power assist because they feel it can add twitchiness and/or take away a bit of the actual tire to steering wheel interface. I have had two Stalker XL's, one with power assist and one without and I prefer the power assist but I am also not tracking them in the sense that autocross has different steering demand characteristics. 

 

The suspension on the M-Spec cars are lightyears better than the original Brunton Stalkers IMHO.

Edited July 7, 2023 by Anaximander

[MV8]

The steering mod causes "quicker" steering at the expense of higher effort. The mod cuts the toe arm end off and drills a hole to make a new, shorter toe attachment that is also further inboard. Standard s10 spindles could be fitted to reduce the effort, with options on the outer tierod attachment and longer adjustment sleeves to reach. Ackeman increases and the geometry is also improved.

 

The fiero and chevette share the same steering rack. This builder may have added a gear reduction in the cowl just forward of the dash panel which would make steering more difficult also. If equipped, that'd be the first thing I'd remove.

 

A power steering pump for a 3800 and power rack from a chevette (fieros were never produced with powersteering) could be added but I don't know how well the pump would fit.

[MV8]

I was just watching the vids. Has some cold running issues. That is a tiny steering wheel. A bigger wheel with a quick release hub would be a given for less effort as Croc was saying, cut about 8 inches from the shifter lever, fit some full size round mufflers and maybe run the exhaust out the back.  Classact007 really wants this puppy. Kicked up to over 14k now.

[preventec47]

I've always been attracted to T-Bucket and other Roadster type cars but much preferred the modernized Lotus designs.  Sorta like comparing outhouses to toilets.   But alls well that ends well in the auction.  I got a chance to examine and test drive what was to me a rocketship in like new condition and maybe someday another one will come up for sale less than a mile away and either be cheaper or I will have a lot more money.     The V8 stalkers are very impressive but I cant help to think that their weight distribution spoils the go-kart handling much like the 427 Cobras.   I could feel some front heaviness in the V6 Super Stalker compared to the Alfa-Romeos I autocrossed years ago.    

[MV8]

I would not assume the bidding war to $18k in the last 10 minutes means either party has the cash. The standard, v6-60 2.8/3.1/3.4l is plenty of umph, cuts about 50 pounds off the front end, and is "agricultural" in durability and maintenance.