SENC Posted June 1 Share Posted June 1 Odd that you're seeing surge when lifting off the throttle, almost like backwash rather than water coming in from the top inlet pipe. Am I interpreting correctly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbcollier Posted June 1 Share Posted June 1 Can you please post some photos of your hose routing and radiator? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SENC Posted June 1 Share Posted June 1 (edited) I just remembered you mentioned the swirlpot is homemade - maybe a picture of that too? Is the design similar to this? Inlet from head to high point on the pot, outlet to radiator at the low point? I'd be tempted to remove the swirlpot and turn the engine over to see if it shoots water up as expected. Edited June 1 by SENC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEM Posted June 1 Author Share Posted June 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEM Posted June 1 Author Share Posted June 1 Video of the swirl pot in action, or inaction. trim.C9CEA96F-7C19-4E29-9FA2-778830B4A255.MOV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEM Posted June 1 Author Share Posted June 1 Nice looking swirl pot. Mine is similar but not near as nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SENC Posted June 1 Share Posted June 1 Interesting design, though I'd wonder if it would be as effective removing air as the more vertical design. Regardless, that wouldn't be your problem I don't think. Looking at the design, I'd expect to see a gush of water coming from top left of the video on increase of rpms. As you've described, the video shows that isn't happening - it does look to me like the outlet is attempting so suck water out upon decel. That leads me to believe the outlet to radiator to pump section is ok and trying to do it's job, but from pump to swirl pot inlet isn't. I'd rig a hose to the pump inlet and remove the swirlpot to see if some hose pressure gets water up through the head. If not, you could open the drain on the block - if it flows there you may have increased the chances it is a head gasket resteicting flow or clog higher up - if not it would suggest a blockage in the block. In the head gasket idea, I do recall from searching for mine that not all are designed the same - any chance of pictures of that gasket from last rebuild? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEM Posted June 1 Author Share Posted June 1 I can get water through the head and up to the swirl pot flange by simply pouring water into the top of the radiator. There is no obstruction. Same for the drain stop cock, no problems draining or flowing out when pouring water into the top of the radiator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEM Posted June 1 Author Share Posted June 1 Tomorrow I'll pull the swirl pot and start the car to see if water gushes out of the open flange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SENC Posted June 1 Share Posted June 1 (edited) very strange, I'm at a loss - unless the swirlpot inlet itself is blocked, it seems either a 2nd bad pump (unlikely) or maybe just enough blockage in the engine to prevent high enough flow to get up to the pot, but not enough to prevent water creeping through. Edited June 2 by SENC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Westfield Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 (edited) do you see bubbles coming up in the swirl pot? could indicate a blown head gasket, letting hot gas into water system. might be worth pressure testing the system you can get loaner testers at many parts stores oil looks ok? if it's a milkshake, it's a head gasket if you pressure test it, and it loses pressure, be sure to pull the plugs and spin it over before starting to prevent hydro lock if that's the only fan, next to the oil cooler, it's doing nothing for you need a better one, mounted on back of radiator, pulling air thru Edited June 2 by 7Westfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEM Posted June 2 Author Share Posted June 2 No bubbles coming up in the swirl pot. That is the only fan as was fitted from the factory. A bigger fan will be fitted but for now a bigger fan will just cool the cool water in the radiator as the hot water from the engine never gets that far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SENC Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 (edited) A longshot, but the cap on your swirlpot isn't a high pressure or malfunctioning cap that is blocking the overflow tube, is it? Wondering if there is any possibility that air pressure is building up in the swirlpot and keeping water from flowing up to it. I'm doubting this since you've run it without the cap at least long enough to see/video activity in the swirlpot but just a thought to consider. Edited June 2 by SENC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SENC Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 3 hours ago, TEM said: Tomorrow I'll pull the swirl pot and start the car to see if water gushes out of the open flange. While you have it off, run a hose into the inlet - would at least give you an idea of what a strong inflow of water should look like from the top. Perhaps it is internally baffled in some way and you wouldn't see obvious flow as in mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbcollier Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 There is no thermostat. When you filled the engine from the swirl pot, very little/no coolant got into the rad. When you filled the rad from the top hose, it took a lot of coolant. When you ran the engine, the block gets hot but not the rad. Water pumps leak and/or wear their bearings out. Very, very seldom is there an impeller issue and certainly not in two in a row. All the above adds up to a blockage in the system. Remove both upper and lower rad hoses completely. Look through the damn things (especially the lower). Is there a rag stuck in there? Is there a flap of rubber partially torn loose? Spray water from a garden hose through each in both directions to make darn sure. Pour water in the rad inlet. Does it also immediately pour out the lower outlet? Remove the swirl pot. Pour water in the "thermostat" opening. Does it pour out the water pump (where the lower hose goes). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEM Posted June 2 Author Share Posted June 2 Hoses are all new, no rags or other blockages. Everything flows with a garden hose or simply pouring water in from a bucket. filling from the top of the rad flows out the bottom hose, filling from the thermostat housing flows out the pump and lower hose, I can fill the entire system from the rad to over flowing from the thermostat opening. Last test (with the video) was filling the system from the top of the radiator with the front end raised to remove any air from the block. One part of the system that I don't like is the swirl pot exit to radiator is lower than the radiator inlet which means there will always be an air pocket at the top of the radiator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbcollier Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 All swirl pots have the incoming coolant higher than the outlet. Their purpose is to separate air out. If you did it the other way, you would add air in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe7 Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 Here's an idea, but not sure its a good one! Try removing the plug in the top of the water pump to see if water comes out with the engine off or when you run the engine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEM Posted June 2 Author Share Posted June 2 JB, I'm not saying that the inlet and outlet of the swirl pot are reversed, I'm saying that the outlet of the swirl pot should be higher than the inlet of the radiator. Yes, swirl pots remove air but in our application they also are the means to fill the system with water. When the tube to the radiator is below the top of the radiator, an air pocket will remain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEM Posted June 2 Author Share Posted June 2 I'll be off line most of the day so no testing until later this afternoon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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