cold Zetec problem

[CrewsT-SPS00014]

I'm having idling problems when I cold start my engine (2.0 Zetec). RPMs fluctuate from 3k down below 1k, almost stalling. Once the engine warms up, it idles smoothly. I recently had my inspection done, and the water temp sensor was suggested as the likely culprit, however I was told I'd need to get a new one through a Ford dealer. The supposed part at Advance Auto was visually definately not what I need.

 

Has anyone had a problem like this, or replaced the water temp sensor for any reason? I haven't even tried to remove the sensor, so I haven't taken it anywhere to match it.

 

FWIW, this is in a Superformance S1.

 

thank you for any advice you can offer a novice (at best)

 

Timothy:7frog:

[Boxologist]

ITBs or stock intake plenum? It sounds symptomatic of a dirty MAF sensor.

[slngsht]

before you spend any money on a sensor, find someone local with a scanner and see if the coolant sensor readings make sense (i.e. close to outside temp when cold, closer to thermostat temp as warming up.

[haiku88]

I'm having idling problems when I cold start my engine (2.0 Zetec). RPMs fluctuate from 3k down below 1k, almost stalling. Once the engine warms up, it idles smoothly. I recently had my inspection done, and the water temp sensor was suggested as the likely culprit, however I was told I'd need to get a new one through a Ford dealer. The supposed part at Advance Auto was visually definately not what I need.

 

Has anyone had a problem like this, or replaced the water temp sensor for any reason? I haven't even tried to remove the sensor, so I haven't taken it anywhere to match it.

 

FWIW, this is in a Superformance S1.

 

thank you for any advice you can offer a novice (at best)

 

Timothy:7frog:

 

 

you can test your sensor with an ohmmeter by checking the resistance at room temperature, freezing (ice water)), and boiling. I did this with mine awhile back and found the specs on the web, but did not save he link...FWIW mine tested OK, the trouble was elsewhere....but I had a different problem

[CrewsT-SPS00014]

before you spend any money on a sensor, find someone local with a scanner and see if the coolant sensor readings make sense (i.e. close to outside temp when cold, closer to thermostat temp as warming up.

 

I have an IR thermometer on order now.

 

I have also attached a pic to the original post of the sensor as shown to me by the mechanic

 

Boxologist: Integrated throttle body, no MAF as far as we can tell

[breezy7]

You might try these 2 Ford Focus sites: www.focusfanatics.com or www.focaljet.com. I don't have any experience with them but both have Zetec forums. Good Luck.

[S1Steve]

Crews T,

Where in Bucks do you live, I also have a S1. I live in Ambler, Mont.

Steve Novelli- cell # 610-724-3415

[CrewsT-SPS00014]

Crews T,

Where in Bucks do you live, I also have a S1. I live in Ambler, Mont.

Steve Novelli- cell # 610-724-3415

 

I've seen you on a few forums...

 

I'm in Churchville... between Feasterville and Richboro.

 

Have you had any idling problems with yours?

[S1Steve]

Tim,

No problems with how it runs. Do you have the Web-Con set-up??

 

Steve

[CrewsT-SPS00014]

Tim,

No problems with how it runs. Do you have the Web-Con set-up??

 

Steve

 

 

I'm tempted to say "yes", I'm not sure. This was originally Don Rosen's car (Dynamic Motorsports, the Ohio Superformance dealer). He had the engine installed, and was unable to find any paperwork to tell me what was done with the engine. All I know or can find out is what's visible when I look at it. If you can tell me what to look for, I can tell you what I see or take pictures. My engine knowledge is very limited at the moment.

 

I saw (different site) you have 185hp at the flywheel. Sounds like an orange S1 I saw for sale online, which was eventually sold at Dynamic 1 week before I was scheduled to drive out to see it. I assume my engine was done by Performance Engineering, as your was, however I suspect your cam is 1 step up from mine. Per Don, the wider powerband of this cam makes it just as fast as the higher hp cam in the orange that I missed out on.

 

I have been tempted on multiple occasions to find out if a 2.3 duratec can squeeze into the compartment, or perhaps add a supercharger. It seems no one has gone beyond NA a 2.0 for this car though. The car's fast as-is, however never hurts to have more power :-)

 

My wishlist is on hold though, as we have a 5 month old... daycare costs are no fun at all.

 

Do you go to any local car shows Steve? Perhaps I could try to meet you at one, assuming the site is suitable for our 7s' low clearance (ie no rough grass field parking).

[yellowss7]

Crewst-SPS00014 wrote:

Do you go to any local car shows Steve?

 

How about you S1 drivers bringing them out to a Philly Region Autox? Or are they too pretty to run? :d Tom

[CrewsT-SPS00014]

Crewst-SPS00014 wrote:

 

 

How about you S1 drivers bringing them out to a Philly Region Autox? Or are they too pretty to run? :d Tom

 

 

Which 7 do you have?

 

Original owner of mine used to AutoX it. Saw an original 7 AutoX in NJ (Giants' stadium parking lot)... he said he couldn't handle the philly guys b/c of the mods they have.

 

I've never tried AutoX. Tempted to from time to time... 2 brothers do it with 944 and boxter.

 

:jonautox:

[yellowss7]

I have a 2000 Caterham Superlight #123. There are plenty of classes for other cars to run in, depending on the state of mods that have been done. There are even a number of street tire classes.

 

Seven's unfortunately by their very nature are too capable/fast so the SCCA forces 7's into the Modified class, where almost anything goes. My Caterham is bone stock, same springs shocks etc. that it comes with from the factory. However, tires are the difference, in Mod, you can run full slicks. That's where the biggest difference would be.

 

That being said, I ran street tires for the first several years, and its still fun. It's really about driving your car to the best of your ability first, then beating the competition/clock second.

 

We have some very good instructors who would be glad to ride with you to help you improve.

 

Come on out, Have fun, and drive your car. :7fume: Tom

[ebeck]

Greetings All... I'm the original owner/builder of the Orange S1 #50, that you are talking about. I drove the Yellow S1 that used to be Dean Rosen's, no comparison. His engine had a mild cam, and the Webcon set-up, and an aluminum flywheel. That's about it. Mine had High Compression Forged pistons, H-Beam rods, Rally Cams, Ford Racing Head, Light Aliminum Flywheel, Rally/Race Trasmission, and most important, Pectel ECU. The Webcon sucks. If you have one, get rid of it. It will make the biggest improvement in your car. I also added a MAP sensor, by machining the intake runners, tied them together, and intalled the sensor. That added a drivability to the car that blew me away.

As far as your cold idle problems go, check your voltage on the TPS, Water Temp, and have a MAP sensor installed. Ditch the Webcon.

By the Way... Dean's old Yellow car has WAY over exaggerated HP/Torque numbers. I have copies of all the Dyno runs for my old Orange S1 (best one on the planet).

 

Get to a good tuner shop, and ask then what ECU they recommend. Let them install and tune on a Mustang Dyno (not DynoJet). That allows tunability at different loads.

[CrewsT-SPS00014]

Greetings All... I'm the original owner/builder of the Orange S1 #50, that you are talking about. I drove the Yellow S1 that used to be Dean Rosen's, no comparison. His engine had a mild cam, and the Webcon set-up, and an aluminum flywheel. That's about it. Mine had High Compression Forged pistons, H-Beam rods, Rally Cams, Ford Racing Head, Light Aliminum Flywheel, Rally/Race Trasmission, and most important, Pectel ECU. The Webcon sucks. If you have one, get rid of it. It will make the biggest improvement in your car. I also added a MAP sensor, by machining the intake runners, tied them together, and intalled the sensor. That added a drivability to the car that blew me away.

As far as your cold idle problems go, check your voltage on the TPS, Water Temp, and have a MAP sensor installed. Ditch the Webcon.

By the Way... Dean's old Yellow car has WAY over exaggerated HP/Torque numbers. I have copies of all the Dyno runs for my old Orange S1 (best one on the planet).

 

Get to a good tuner shop, and ask then what ECU they recommend. Let them install and tune on a Mustang Dyno (not DynoJet). That allows tunability at different loads.

 

 

I don't know if you remember, but I contacted you to ask a million questions when you decided to sell. I had actually printed out the webpage and kept track of your asking price, waiting for the right number. When I saw the price drop on the web page you had set up, right into my range, I wanted to buy it from you. I never herad back from you though. Since yours sold a week too soon for my arrival, I had to wait for this yellow one to come in. I do enjoy driving it, but would certainly have preferred your orange.

 

The comparison in performance was from Dean (mistakenly said Don in earlier post)... he claimed they are comparable since your cam had a narrow power band and this cam was wider. He was supposed to give me a build sheet and dyno info, but never did.

 

If I had some $$ to spend on the car at the moment, I'd have some work done on it, but unfortunately daycare and house improvements are eating up any hope of some upgrading at the moment. I'm in SE PA, just above Philly, so I can't drop by Performance Engineering for help. I'm open to other tuner locations, but only for checking things out and addressing my idle problem if I can't sort it out myself. Ideally I'd ship the car out to Performance Engineering, have them take a look and give me options to match the orange #50.

 

Have you picked up another seven yet? Would you do anything different the second time around if you did get one?

[richardjbondy]

I have the Webcon Alpha Gold Zetec System as installed on the S1 and experienced the exact same idle issue. My Zetec is in an '61 Austin Healey Sprite though. The problem was caused by carbon in the cold start valve. Remove the tiny air cleaner, remove the valve assembly from the car. Spray with brake cleaner while working the sliding valve. The idle will return to normal. The engineers at Webcon told me to remount this valve as high as possible to reduce soot from being trapped. You can view my installation at :

 

www.britishv8.org/Other/RichardBondy.htm

 

For further info contact www.webcon.co.uk they are great folks, friendly & helpful ! They have a wonderful build manual for the alpha system that comes with the kit. Why don't you get one from them, it is vey helpful. If that doesn't work let me know and I'll copy mine for you.

\Rick

[JohnK]

I'm having idling problems when I cold start my engine (2.0 Zetec). RPMs fluctuate from 3k down below 1k, almost stalling. Once the engine warms up, it idles smoothly. I recently had my inspection done, and the water temp sensor was suggested as the likely culprit, however I was told I'd need to get a new one through a Ford dealer. The supposed part at Advance Auto was visually definately not what I need.

 

Has anyone had a problem like this, or replaced the water temp sensor for any reason? I haven't even tried to remove the sensor, so I haven't taken it anywhere to match it.

 

FWIW, this is in a Superformance S1.

 

thank you for any advice you can offer a novice (at best)

 

Timothy:7frog:

 

There are a number different calibrations out there for the Webcon fitted to the Superformance S1 / Zetec stock engine. These are burned onto an ordinary memory chip and plugged into the ECU Many are awful, a few are pretty reasonable and a last generation could be called pretty darn good, considering the engine is stock. Maybe 6 or 8 cars out there have the first one developed (by a now-nameless and long-since-disappeard tuner) at Performance Engineering (reasonable performance) , and several have a second generation tune (pretty darn good performance). The results of these attempts created very good "drivability", rather than simply maximum wide-open-throttle horsepower You might reference S1Steve as someone who's had experience with both calibrations as to how well they perform. I would not start over with a different brand of ECU until you've spent a bit of time getting familiar with what you have. I'm certain that, with a bit of searching you could find someone who's running the final generation Performance Engineering tune and get a copy of the calibration that you could plug into your system and get good performance. For an electronics guy, it's a no-brainer to copy a chip, and there are no copyright issues here.

Your idle problem, if you're running the original Superformance-fitted calibration, may be the calibration. Alternatively there could well be something as simple as a loose wire. If it goes away when it warms up, it may well be the calibration. I'd be inclined to ignore it

If you work at it, you could spend a ton of money and accumulate even more frustration and a bad-attitude to boot. ECU's in general are complicated and there are not many people (in my own humble experience) who understand them well enough to be really useful to you. I spoke with Webcon in England (who were very nice and knowledgeable) and they never came up with a good explanation as to why the calibration for the Zetec supplied to the Superformance in Cincinnati that ran fine in England on the identical engine would run so awful on the same Zetec in the USA. Best of luck. I still have always felt that the Superformance S1 is the best overall deal for the money out there

Cheers,