PCA bans Caterhams from US HPDE events for being too fast

[Croc]

Martin - Thanks for putting this discussion on a technical footing (despite me being slightly mischievous above).

 

Just to clarify, while you need to refer to the club racing rules to find the correct reg that governs permissible cars the original issue only comes from eligible participation in HPDE/track days.

 

Extracting the essence of your comments:

 

As for Driver's Ed or DE.....as stated in Driver's Education Minimum Standards Definition paragraph 36. Time Trials of the National Standards and is "open to all cars that have fenders attached to the vehicle body at all four corners" as described in the minimum standards Definition see link http://www.pca.org/portals/de/2012%20Driver%20Education%20min%20std%202012.pdf

 

From the discussions Yellowss7 and myself were having with the PCA official last Friday (lets leave him/her unnamed to protect our useful source), the rule you refer to above was revised in July 2012. Prior to July 2012 this rule did not contain the bolded text. Prior to the recent rule change there was no rule to prevent a Seven with front cycle wings (or clamshells) from participating in PCA HPDE.

 

Following the modification with the new rule text, cycle wing cars are clearly prohibited - as was intended by PCA. However, clamshells would still be permissible but was beyond the intent of the PCA when making their rule modification (again as per PCA official).

 

I have not seen or been told that a Caterham or Berkin or Westfield or Locost Sevens with Clamshell fenders would fall into the classification of an open wheel car (Formula Car) for an autocross or DE or Time Trial if they have clamshell fenders as it is not to be wheel to wheel competition as DE and Time Trials are for training and to establish grid class's by ability and speed for safety reasons and barging rights if you get my meaning.

 

This is good information - however, what is your understanding when the seven is equipped with cycle wings as is more common in recent production sevens?

 

By the way, Karl's car is equipped with cycle wings. My speculation was that if Karl installed clams them he would again be eligible to run with PCA HPDE (no competition - just HPDE). Obviously that would last about as long until PCA Exec realized they goofed with the reg rewrite done in July 2012 and made another change to achieve their desired intent.

 

As for Driver's Ed or DE.....as stated in Driver's Education Minimum

 

The Lotus 7 Type Cars are classed in the X class as all non Porsche's are for classing purposes for DE and Time Trial's to the best of my knowledge and understanding and many Porsche owners just do not have a clue to what a fun car a 7 is and they are just jealous I due belive.

 

I can only agree with you wholeheartedly!

[Croc]

....Berkin....

 

 

 

From the dictionary a berk (plural berks)

1. (UK, slang, pejorative) A fool, prat, twit.
   
2. (UK, slang) An idiot, in an affectionate sense.
   

So a Berkin must be a car driven by a Berk? What does that make Birkin (or the rare Birkin SV) owners? :jester:

[blubarisax]

well then, I'm just going to get a Porsche 804 body kit for my Caterham.... No one will ever notice

[S1Steve]

well then, I'm just going to get a Porsche 804 body kit for my Caterham.... No one will ever notice

 

Nope...

[MHKflyer52]

From the dictionary a berk (plural berks)

1. (UK, slang, pejorative) A fool, prat, twit.
   
2. (UK, slang) An idiot, in an affectionate sense.
   

So a Berkin must be a car driven by a Berk? What does that make Birkin (or the rare Birkin SV) owners? :jester:

 

I never did say I can spell......:jester:.....

[MHKflyer52]

 

This is good information - however, what is your understanding when the seven is equipped with cycle wings as is more common in recent production sevens?

 

Croc,

 

My understanding of the rule is that a 7 (new or old) with cycle wings will not be accepted as it dose not meet the requirements for the fenders attached to the body.

You have to remember that the rules are a guide for the Region and Zone event administrators, designed to try to protect all concerned and can be veg but also very direct / strict just for that reason.

A lot of the Zone and Region's have even tougher rules to deal with for PCA events.

I also went back to the rule books that I have from 2005 and have even looked at the proposed rules for 2013 which are being reviewed for discussion by the rules committee and do not see this being changed nor has it changed to my knowledge which is limited to say the least as I am not on that committee.

 

Hope the information I have provided helps.

[blubarisax]

http://i913.photobucket.com/albums/ac336/blubarisax/th_IMG-20120902-00038.jpg

 

I guess my kissing the tire wall brought the rules to light. I was happier for being too fast.

[Boxologist]

Seriously Jon, we would all love you to join us at the track at the next event!

 

After hearing about several other friends cars not coming back from PDX/HPDE events this summer, when you see me I will tending grill or bar if the day is over.

 

Shame about the PCA ruling. Riesentoter has always offered the best price on getting onto the track. MetroNY chief intructor is a person I trust, but doubt he can fit in to a fat bastard Caterham. Perhaps I will have take up an offer on a guest pass at Millville, but I don't see that date coming soon.

[Croc]

.....when you see me I will tending grill or bar if the day is over......Perhaps I will have take up an offer on a guest pass at Millville, but I don't see that date coming soon

 

You are on! Free non-driving guest pass coming up just for you. Keep the weekend of Nov 17/18 free - it will be a group I think you will enjoy. I cannot think of anyone more experienced that I want handling my drinks!

 

 

Shame about the PCA ruling. Riesentoter has always offered the best price on getting onto the track. MetroNY chief intructor is a person I trust....

 

Agree completely with this one. This is why I am disappointed with the PCA thinking and I am concerned it is the start of a slippery slope for our cars.