Fuzzy Math?

[yellowss7]

A vehicle at 15 mpg and 12,000 miles per year uses 800 gallons a year of

gasoline.

A vehicle at 25 mpg and 12,000 miles per year uses 480 gallons a

year.

 

So, the average clunker transaction will reduce US gasoline consumption by

320 gallons per year.

 

They claim 700,000 vehicles – so that's 224 million gallons /

year.

That equates to a bit over 5 million barrels of oil.

 

5 million barrels of oil is about ¼ of one day's US consumption.

And, 5 million barrels of oil costs about $350 million dollars at

$75/bbl.

So, we all contributed to spending $3 billion to save $350

million.

How good a deal was that ???

 

Can't wait for the next "deal":deadhorse:

[pksurveyor]

The mechanic who maintains my company vehicles for more than 20 years offers his point of view from a small auto repair business perspective:

 

 

1. The people who were driving clunkers can not afford to buy new cars. This is the reason that they are driving clunkers.

 

2. These same people who are driving shiny new cars now will discover the joy of car payment and insurance premium. The full coverage on a new car is considerable more than the minimum coverage on a clunker.

 

3. So, after a few months of stretching their budget to make payments, these new car owners will skip and the cars will be repossessed by the lenders. Does it sound familiar?

 

4. At the same time, the small business auto repair shops will be struggling to survive because the clunkers that they have been repairing have been crushed.

 

5. The demand for independent auto repair shops will be further reduced because all these 700,000 shiny new cars have 3 to 4 years warranty.

 

6. My mechanic is now down to an one man operation. He has to lay off his helpers because his steady customers no longer need him to keep their clunkers on the road.

[slngsht]

Tom, the only problem with your calculation is the number of years on the road. if the clunkers stay on the road 5 more years, the savings would be $1.75B. If price of a oil goes to $120, savings would be 2.8B.

 

I'm at a loss as to what would work to reduce dependence on oil. The conservative in me says let the free market take care of it, but clearly by looking at the last 20 years, we go and buy gas guzzlers if given the choice. We always have our d***s on the chopping block waiting for the next oil price crisis. NOBODY favors an increase in gas tax as a solution. So what is a solution to REALLY reducing our consumption? alternative energy (like just substituting ethanol for gasoline in the same gas guzzlers) is not the answer IMO. That affects price of food supply. Electric / Hybrids help.

Ultimately it's a social thing. The answer is some combination of really increasing efficiency, reducing gridlock and miles, traveled, etc. It'd be great if all those things happened on their own before we end up in a crisis situation, but what market forces do you see pushing us in that direction? I don't see any free market solution other than gas prices going through the roof - and we have seen what that did to our economy.

As a nation, we just don't give a damn about the true cost of our dependence on foreign oil. Price at the pump is a component of it.

[scannon]

I bought a "clunker" '97 Honda Civic EX coupe last week for a winter beater and general daily driver. It got 35 mpg on its first fill up.

 

Except for towing/hauling duties it will replace my Silverado which gets 17 mpg at best. Based on the difference in gas mileage it looks like it will pay for itself in about two years of driving.

 

The Civic turned out to be a better car than I thought when I bought it. Only 93k miles, no rust, runs like a Honda and it cleaned up very well.

 

Only downside is the insurance. Due to the theft rates for Civics it has the highest premium in my fleet of four vehicles other than the Se7en which is insured to a stated value with Hagerty.

 

I paid cash for it. That's my personal Cash for Clunkers story.

[yellowss7]

Thanks for the clarification Mazda. I thought it might be too simple a calculation.

 

My personal action to the oil situation is to burn as much 100 Octane Sunoco GT Race fuel as I can per minute of driving. :driving: I'll let my friends on the Left coast save my share as they sit in traffic. :seeya:

 

I'm already paying $8 a gallon for the race fuel. Bring it on!!!

 

Burn it if you got it. You can't take it with you.

 

Tom:driving:

[pksurveyor]

I confessed that I have participated in the Cash for Clunkers program. I traded in one of my Ford F150 field trucks for a Toyota Tacoma. The Toyota gets 4 mpg more than the Ford with 190,000 miles.

 

I paid cash so there is no worry about missing car payments.

[lowflyer]

One, often overlooked, feature of the C4C program is that the money received from the Guvment is taxable in most states!

 

Surprise.

[Kitcat]

I have a friend who works in a Ford factory. He's getting overtime for the first time in a long time. He now feels he can afford to send his son to the local state college. He's not complaining.

[thegoat]

There are also the emissions reductions, potential safety increases, and car dealership benefits. There are significantly greater benefits than just oil.

[slngsht]

  thegoat said:

There are also the emissions reductions, potential safety increases, and car dealership benefits. There are significantly greater benefits than just oil.

of course the down side is that it contributes to the spend, spend, spend mentality that we as a nation have gotten used to.