LS1 Stalker Article

[Bonjo2]

Stationed at Langley Air Force Base in VA. From MA, but a FL resident.. Like a rolling stone.

[DeanG]

Stationed at Langley Air Force Base in VA. From MA, but a FL resident.. Like a rolling stone.

 

We are in the flight pattern here in Newport News. We need to get together.

[kennyrayandersen]

I'm not agin the LS[X], but wonder about the last gen V-6s that come in the Camaro from the LLT 302 HP to the 2012 323 HP LFX version which is another 20 Lb lighter -- seems like with the aluminum block they would be lighter than the V-8 and 323 HP is certainly nothing to shake a stick at. Same HP as the supercharged V-6, but NA and made to run on regular! Direct injection 11.3:1 on regular gas! It looks pretty good on paper! Is there a reason that engine wouldn't be a good candidate for the Stalker, like too tall, almost the same weight etc?

 

Also, is the V-8 low enough profile that the hood bulge can be removed?

Edited July 16, 2011 by kennyrayandersen

[BusaNostra]

Talking about lightweight hi-reviving engine

http://www.thedetroitbureau.com/2011/05/next-corvette-to-target-euro-supercar-fans-with-small-high-revving-turbo-v8/

 

maybe wait for this engine.

[WestTexasS2K]

What's great about the v8 is the torque the v6 isn't going to make as much. You can go up to 650hp on the v8 and still run pump gas. Just more room to grow with the v8. I understand that most are not interested in this level of power but a few are.

[Jim Gunther]

I have been high on the LY-7 engines but don't don't know if anyone has even taken the measurements to see if it will fit. Seriously, I have tried several times to get the physical dimensions (i.e. blueprints) but, as yet, been unable to do so.

 

Any help/links appreciated.

 

 

 

I'm not agin the LS[X], but wonder about the last gen V-6s that come in the Camaro from the LLT 302 HP to the 2012 323 HP LFX version which is another 20 Lb lighter -- seems like with the aluminum block they would be lighter than the V-8 and 323 HP is certainly nothing to shake a stick at. Same HP as the supercharged V-6, but NA and made to run on regular! Direct injection 11.3:1 on regular gas! It looks pretty good on paper! Is there a reason that engine wouldn't be a good candidate for the Stalker, like too tall, almost the same weight etc?

 

Also, is the V-8 low enough profile that the hood bulge can be removed?

[kennyrayandersen]

What's great about the v8 is the torque the v6 isn't going to make as much. You can go up to 650hp on the v8 and still run pump gas. Just more room to grow with the v8. I understand that most are not interested in this level of power but a few are.

 

Yeah, no doubt, but as the car usually takes a V-6 anyway, and frankly 323 HP is really going to be enough for most folk, plus I saw some exhaust and intake mods that added around 25-30 more ponies, so I'm thinking it could well be the 'low-level' version:drool:

 

Anyway, I'm not sure how much lighter it would be, but it would loose a bit of weight, gain some economy, and I'm pretty sure unless you spent a fair amount on an LS V-8 you won't get SO much more HP (it's there for sure, but it ain't free (speed costs, how fast do you want to go?)).

 

I looked up the new Camaro and it weighs around 3500 pounds!!! I'm thinking the same engine in something that weighed 2000 Lb less should have adequate (LOL) acceleration. I just don't see myself needing more than 325-350 HP (I probably would never track it enough to get good enough to make that extra HP 'count'.

 

Plus, there is something appealing about getting something that you could leave bone-stock (for reliability) and have it perform the way I think this one would. I think that's what's pretty appealing about the S2K (even though I know you couldn't kep your hand off that either!:rofl:). Anyway, it would seem a better [V-6] choice than a 1980s engine!

[kennyrayandersen]

I have been high on the LY-7 engines

 

Any help/links appreciated.

 

as long as that's all you're high on:jester:

[erioshi]

Talking about lightweight hi-reviving engine

http://www.thedetroitbureau.com/2011/05/next-corvette-to-target-euro-supercar-fans-with-small-high-revving-turbo-v8/

 

maybe wait for this engine.

mmmmm .. OHC (or possibly DOHC?) turbocharged ~3 liter dry sump V8 with near 10K red line? Sounds fantastic. Enough to make me want to put one of these engines into something to play with, especially on a race track.

 

But with so much new (to the GM production lines) technology all being pushed together at the same time, it might be wise to wait until any teething problems have been worked out.

 

This also makes me wonder if there might not be some distant relationship between this engine program and the new Lotus V8? Pure speculation, but both engines sound similar and need to be in production ready vehicles due out at about the same time .. interesting coincidence.

[Klasik-69]

OHC engines have a higher center of gravity and increased complexity from the very nature of their design. The OHV engines of GM have been able to match OHC engine output without the problems associated. Yes, its low-tech in many ways but if it works, why change it. Also, as the engines change to OHC, the cost goes up. Direct injection increases power and efficiency but also raises the cost. For a drop in engine in a 7 type chassis, we're going to be coming close to the cost of the Cosworth engines. Last quote I got was around $19K for a 2.3L and 290 HP, which is $5K more than an LS7. By the way, the Cosworth is without any tranny or ECU, as is the cost of the LS7.

 

If the argument is one of "cost is no object", then I would go with a supercharged LS9 motor which is around the same price as the Cosworth 290 HP and weighs in at almost the same weight. How we could keep the rubber on the pavement is another question. However, the acceleration coming out of a sweeper and heading into a long straight, as with Roebling Road would be breathless. Going into turn 1 at around 180 mph would force one to wear depends.:driving:

[BusaNostra]

Well, if I will put a V8 in my 7 and if money has no object....then

I will go for Hartley http://www.h1v8.com/page/page/1562068.htm

 

I'm a weight watcher when it comes to my 7 - no boat anchor V8 for me.

[Kitcat]

Don't show this Hartley link to Karl. In fact, I am sorry I saw it:).

[Jim Gunther]

For a drop in engine in a 7 type chassis, we're going to be coming close to the cost of the Cosworth engines. Last quote I got was around $19K for a 2.3L and 290 HP, which is $5K more than an LS7. By the way, the Cosworth is without any tranny or ECU, as is the cost of the LS7. :

 

One of the most appealing aspects of the Stalker is the total reliance on American parts. The new stuff (i'.e Disk calipers etc) is off-the-shelf cheap. Last time I checked, you could get a low mielage LY7 take-out (albeit from a Caddy - same technology and almost same tune) for$2,000.

[kennyrayandersen]

One of the most appealing aspects of the Stalker is the total reliance on American parts. The new stuff (i'.e Disk calipers etc) is off-the-shelf cheap. Last time I checked, you could get a low mielage LY7 take-out (albeit from a Caddy - same technology and almost same tune) for$2,000.

 

Agreed! -- life would be really cool if you had no financial limitations!

 

What I learned from Econ 110:

 

Man has insatiable wants and desires, but only a limited means to get them...

[gerald kenneth bowden]

when i was a kid in the mid 50th i had a mgtd 1952 it could do 75 mph. this was a great car to have fun . that is why i have lotus 7 to day not to go fast but to have fun i am 76 years old still have a motorcycle and drive both has much as i can.

[Bruntonauto]

We have looked at the new V6 and it is simply too big. Like mentioned before, OHC engines also have a high center of gravity. The LS V8 is not much bigger and much shorter than OHC 4 cylinder engines. The LS should not be confused with a "small block" either. This is a completly different motor. The only thing they have in common is the displacement and the in block cam. Pump is on the front, different head and port designs, fire order is different, and the silky smooth plastic intake manifold actually crisscrosses for long runners and weighs almost nothing. Plus the manifold can be flipped around backwards to fit the stalker nicely. And if you ever need parts for a stalker, there is a good chance there is an autoparts store or a chevy dealer close by.

 

The low profile of the V8 almost gets rid of the scoop on the stalker. We are currently building our 2nd turnkey v8 with no scoop. We add an extra 1.25" to the height of the frame and it clears with no scoop. We are also working on a new hood design that has a cowl induction style hood.

[twnpipe]

Domestic engines should be simple to get parts for - Today I was looking for metric to standard pipe fittings for my improved Miata, and no one had any. Then again my Ford truck is a mixture of metric and american, and its ultralite weight smooth intake manifold cracked last year ($$$$$$$$$$), the valve covers leak, the switches dont' all work. But I do look forward to the new Bruntons, where do I get a chance to drive one to compare it to my turbo Miata 7 ?

[kennyrayandersen]

We have looked at the new V6 and it is simply too big. Like mentioned before, OHC engines also have a high center of gravity. The LS V8 is not much bigger and much shorter than OHC 4 cylinder engines. The LS should not be confused with a "small block" either. This is a completly different motor. The only thing they have in common is the displacement and the in block cam. Pump is on the front, different head and port designs, fire order is different, and the silky smooth plastic intake manifold actually crisscrosses for long runners and weighs almost nothing. Plus the manifold can be flipped around backwards to fit the stalker nicely. And if you ever need parts for a stalker, there is a good chance there is an autoparts store or a chevy dealer close by.

 

The low profile of the V8 almost gets rid of the scoop on the stalker. We are currently building our 2nd turnkey v8 with no scoop. We add an extra 1.25" to the height of the frame and it clears with no scoop. We are also working on a new hood design that has a cowl induction style hood.

 

Thanks for the feedback -- I had wondered if the height wouldn't be an issue, but it's hard to tell from pictures! The cost per performance certainly keeps the stalker in the 'hunt'.

[sciff5]

Question for Bruntonauto

 

 

I know with the LS3s lots of guys have needed to use a dry sump to get proper oiling and in the ls swapped rx7 forum there have been several oiling issues even with the ls1/ls6s which are generally considered in terms of oil control a little better.

 

Have you guys started racing any lsx stalkers and if so what have you done to handle oil control and drainback issues?

 

I am currently running a baffled pan in my ls1 rx7 with the stock oiling system.. but I run on street tires, so I wouldent expect an issue anyway.

[sciff5]

bump.. still wondering about the adequacy of the wet sump oiling systems in the stalker chassis