NJMP 9-27-12 a little spin

[yellowss7]

Sorry Kitcat, Croc is right, his Cosworth hp is 1/3 more than my RoverK.

My 195bhp is at the crank. My right foot is also alot lighter and shorter than his and yours too. :jester: Tom

[Croc]

275FWHP for me and 195FWHP for Tom makes me 41% more than Tom. How do I know this so well? Tom beat me up and won a bar room argument on hp one day when I accused him being much closer to me in the hp stakes. While i do not have a dyno sheet, I do have a Cosworth letter certifying they dynoed at 275hp at their UK facility. No reason to sue them yet...

 

More food for thought - I have the same gearbox and diff ratios as Tom. He would get to the same speeds I am doing if he had a longer straight.

 

And Tom is 'lighter in his loafers' around a track... :jester:

Edited September 7, 2012 by Croc

[Kitcat]

I know I am a skeptic but mfg hp claims often are a bit puffy. For instance, Birkin says my engine makes 210 hp, dyno says 165. Caterham said my X-flow made 135 hp, dyno said 95.

 

Wld love to see real world back to back dyno results, you vs. Tom. Your car is fast and your top speed is consistently much more than Tom and me, so clearly, you have more power. Still, I'd love to see a dyno sheet on your car, or Karl's, added to the dyno sheet smack down thread.

[yellowss7]

Croc, I'll show you mine, if you show me yours. :smilielol5:

dyno sheet caterham.pdf

[Croc]

What's a couple of cubic inches between friends? :cheers:

 

It is interesting that my engine was originally ordered through the Cosworth CEO by a personal friend. It had some special treatments that are not in the standard Caterham 260 spec engine because of its unusual purchase channel. No idea what that counts for but I happily made a mess of my shorts once I realized the car became available through CAT USA and I could afford to have a midlife crisis without a woman to eff it up. I think Karl may have had a similar indecent experience when getting his motor.

 

One day I will get it dynoed but for now I am happy and secure in the knowledge that I can lap Tom in a 20 minute session and monster most other cars

 

And Kitcat, as for your spurious :jester: hp claims I would point out:

1) the 135hp Crossflow was a flywheel advertising claim and not a rear wheel claim as you dynoed it for 95hp. Allowing for drivetrain loss the numbers look to be within a more reasonably tolerance.

2) Dyno or no dyno, a 210hp Birkin is no longer a 210hp Birkin when the owner detonates it and has to replace it with a something of dubious provenance pulled out of some random 'chick car' or a "mommyobile" that had been trashed in a supermarket fight over a parking space! :hat:

[Klasik-69]

Youtube will ask you if you want it to fix shaky videos during the upload process. Unfortunately I find it makes the video worse!

 

NJMP has the two tracks - Thunderbolt and Lightning.

 

http://www.njmp.com/facility/track-maps.html

 

 

In the video, Tom was running the Lightning circuit which is shorter but really quite fun because of the flowing nature. Momentum driving styles work well here. The other track, Thunderbolt is far more technical but is an interesting challenge for a seven as the first half is open and fast but the second half tightens up tremendously. So the big hp cars get away quickly but you reel them back quickly later on as they lurch through the slow bits.

 

Assuming no traffic issues - On Lightning the front straight sees me top out around 125mph if I get a clear run on a cool day and about 105mph on the back straight. Drop that around 10-13mph on a hot day. This is from GPS logging data I collect. Speedo for my car reads 10mph faster but we all know how accurate that is!

 

Assuming no traffic issues - For Thunderbolt, the front straight is about 135mph on a cool day with a clear run and about 110mph on the back straight. Hot days drop you back 10-15mph. With a passenger on a hot day takes you down 15-20mph.

 

Now those speeds are for my car which has a third more hp than Tom. I have GPS data on a November day showing Tom getting to around 121mph area on the front straight of Thunderbolt. He struggles to about 115mph on a hot day.

 

If you want to get a sense of the laps with some data then try these videos:

 

Lightning - Traffic is a problem up to about 3 minutes then it clears out and MichaelD (with the be-winged seven in front) and I start having decent runs.

 

Thunderbolt - Data logged footage of me following Kitcat on a nice clean lap staring 0.30:

 

Come and join us next June when we have the sevens event. We could do with some more sevens who like going fast!

 

Great footage and equally great driving. It sure looks like a fun track. I assume you're using Traqmate to imbed the track data onto the video of the GoPro camera. Is it difficult to do ? I also notice that your video is a lot smoother than mine from my early model GoPro camera. I find a lot of shaking no matter where or how I mount the camera. I've used the suction cup on the cowling, the roll bar mount, and every other way I could think of and it seems I get a lot of shake. Could it be my driving ? :willy_nilly:

 

I've been looking at the new GoPro HD2 or whatever model the latest is. I see they offer a WiFi option that just came out. However, if I go with the Traqmate it may not be of any use. What do you think is the best way to go ?

 

Yeah, I'd love to go to NJMP............however, 1100 miles from Florida is a bit of a drive. Do you guys ever go south ? I saw some pictures of your gang and you look like a fun bunch and great friends. Not much 7 activity here in the South like you have up there.

 

Thanks for helping me out with information.

[Klasik-69]

I know I am a skeptic but mfg hp claims often are a bit puffy. For instance, Birkin says my engine makes 210 hp, dyno says 165. Caterham said my X-flow made 135 hp, dyno said 95.

 

Wld love to see real world back to back dyno results, you vs. Tom. Your car is fast and your top speed is consistently much more than Tom and me, so clearly, you have more power. Still, I'd love to see a dyno sheet on your car, or Karl's, added to the dyno sheet smack down thread.

 

I agree with you. I was surprised with my Caterham while the engine was rated at 202 HP at the crank. First dyno showed 170.3 rwhp, running way lean. After I replaced in the incorrect fuel injectors and remapped the fuel and ignition on the ECU, we pulled 187 rwhp. Jon at Cat USA says they under rate their engine output, and mine was likely closer to 215+ at the crank. I suppose they have variations from engine to engine. To be honest, I need more skill than hp. Using hp to regain momentum is detrimental.

[Croc]

Hi Klasik

 

Its not Traqmate. At the time of purchase I looked at it and thought it was too expensive, the integrated camera option was not HD (I think it is now?) and it required fixed installation to a car. I wanted something flexible, accurate and could handle good quality video. So I looked at bike lap timers and now use this:

 

http://racechronosystems.com/index.shtml

 

Its dead easy to set and use. No driving around the circuit or playing with software to get a circuit to record. Easy to use with the touchscreen. With the included GPS logger, I bluetooth the logger and the touchscreen together and put the touchscreen in a fixed pocket on the car interior. There is a live timer screen but I do use it. I could always mount it on the dash if I want - suction mount, screws or superstrong velcro. It is very easy to switch around between cars. The GPS logger matchbox sized thing is mounted on the transmission tunnel with velcro. It can last an entire weekend before needing to recharge.

 

Touchscreen unit batteries last all day without needing recharge. I export the data in a separate CSV spreadsheet for each individual session and import it and the GoPro video for the same session into RaceRender. I can have 4 videos and data and a separate audio track for synchronization - surprisingly easy to do once you understand the process.

 

http://www.racerender.com/RR2/Features.html

 

Once I have merged the data then I edit if I need to otherwise I just study it myself to work out where I have gone wrong again. I can usually see the tach and I have speed on screen which is my biggest clue for whether I am faster or slower through a corner. I also have actual lap times and splits by sector but I do not show that on video.

 

I have also tried out the QStarz LTQ6000 which does the same stuff but is not intuitive with all the buttons and needs software to set the start/finish line (because I am not allowed to stop the car there during a session!).

 

Some people may find it clunky with having to merge things afterwards but 2xGoPro HD2 (front and the other moves around from rear view, cockpit, wishbone, bedroom, etc) and a touchscreen pro with the bluetooth GPS logger is still cheaper than the comparable Traqmate and I think it is easier to use, less hassle to install and just as useful. If money was not an issue I would look past the Traqmate and go for the VBox Lite unit once they have released the new HD camera option (maybe they have now?). This has superb analysis software - the best I have tried out there for looking at car data, circuit and camera simultaneously. The big bonus is all of the data and video footage is synchonized automatically.

 

 

For cameras it really is a toss up. I am very sure it is not your driving. GoPro is more expensive but has more accessories. I use mine underwater, on the track, skydiving, on the road, dodgy third world country travel, and now in aircraft so I can add lens filters, various mounts, etc to get great results. If you are less interested in the accessories then I would go for a Drift HD as for the same price as a GoPro HD2 you get the included wifi remote, same quality picture, external mic option, waterproof, inbuilt LCD screen for aiming. On a GoPro the wifi remote and LCD screen are extra and mutually exclusive. The wifi on the Gopro also chews through batteries at a rapid rate - something that I have not seen the Drift Hd do. The GoPro is much better protected - I have put mine on the lower front wishbones for track work and the case has taken some big hits.

 

To stabilize your video footage you need to have the right mount and video setting. Try your Gopro on the highest frames per second with the highest resolution you can get with that. On the HD2 I can get 1080 30fps but that gives me rolling shutter effect on a track car. So dropping the setting to 960 48fps or even 720 60fps makes a steadier image and not much drop in resolution quality.

 

For mounts I would forget what comes with the kits and order up a nice manfrotto mount with a rotating ball head:

http://www.sevenspeed.co.uk/products/manfrotto-super-clamp-with-ball-and-socket-head

 

Solid as a rock, versatile, super quick and easy to put on and take off and cheaper than the Gopro mounts. B&H has them for sale here:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/546356-REG/Manfrotto_035RL_035RL_Super_Clamp_with.html

and

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/687361-REG/Oben_BD_0_BD_0_TABLE_TOP_BALL.html

 

I would recommend taping the surface to be clamped with painter tape/or a thin rubber liner (to protect the surface) and putting a safety tether on.

 

1000 miles is a haul whether you travel north or south. Sadly I do not own a trailer (or even a vehicle with a tow hitch) as I am one of these people in NYC who lives with no parking space - so I drive to the circuit, run and spin around and then drive home (although I will fix that problem next year). It would be a haul to drive to Florida for me in the seven. I will say it is awesome fun running around with other sevens - I am very lucky to have a good group of drivers local to me!

Edited September 7, 2012 by Croc

[Klasik-69]

Thank you so much for the information, and taking the time to explain how all of ths works.

 

Since I do travel to some far off tracks, I do have both an open car trailer and a 24' enclosed trailer for getting the car & gear to the track. The open trailer is a lot easier to tow & burns less gas in my truck. I may have to just make a commitment to join your crowd at NJ MP next year.

 

Glad you told me of a cheaper option than Traqmate, $1299 w/o accessories. My old GoPro doesn't have many options & it has the wide angle fish eye lens. No mic port either, so not much to offer. Oh, forgot that it has horrible sound recording too. I'll look up the sites & sources you provided. Again, many thanks.

[JBH]

Mike

 

I'm not a big fan of taking video, but the details of your system and all the options is so thorough that I copied it to a word file that I will save in the event I change my mind. Thanks for sharing!