wdb's little yellow journey

[MV8]

Three 1/8x2x4 strips with one end drilled to 3/8, some chain big enough for a 3/8 bolt to fit through at the end link, an adjustable balance point beam the length of the head. Two for the upper bellhousing bolts and one for the crank bolt, bent 45-90 degrees in a vice with a hammer (must be far enough away from the crank bolt washer for the bend to start).

 

Most of the weight would be on the bell bolts which would be fine if the bolts are normal tight. The front would just be for balance and everything should be easy to remove after it's back in. Can use rags or bits of plywood to prevent potential gouges/scratches.

 

Possible to do without the strips and use the pump flange but why risk it?

[wdb]

I saw images of hoist straps being used around various bits of the cylinder head. It looked secure and substantial. Another one used longer slings completely under the engine but I did not love the front sling tucked behind the driveshaft pulley.
 

i like the idea of straps versus chains. I do have a balance beam. 

[MV8]

Rope is another option. I'd rather not hang anything off a rare, aluminum head. I like hanging from above the bell so the cg is below the attachment and bolted-on tabs can't slip out of place during the process. The chain should only touch the tabs and the sling beam.

Edited May 15, 2023 by MV8

[wdb]

43 minutes ago, MV8 said:

Rope is another option. I'd rather not hang anything off a rare, aluminum head. I like hanging from above the bell so the cg is below the attachment and bolted-on tabs can't slip out of place during the process. The chain should only touch the tabs and the sling beam.

Some good points there. I was originally not inclined to hang the engine by the intake runners, tempting as it may be, but having seen several pictures of it being done I started to feel less antsy. But you're right, it's a rare thing. I think I will use your suggestion of the two top bell housing bolts, then use a strap under the front side. There's just no good place on the front right side of the motor to bolt something on, and I like the idea of using the crankshaft bolt about as much as I like hanging it by the head.

[IamScotticus]

consider the metallurgy of the fasteners...shear points and all.  you might want to make sure your lifting bolts and hardware are grade 8 at least.  you don't want an oh sh1t moment 

Edited May 15, 2023 by IamScotticus

[wdb]

3 hours ago, IamScotticus said:

consider the metallurgy of the fasteners...shear points and all.  you might want to make sure your lifting bolts and hardware are grade 8 at least.  you don't want an oh sh1t moment 

I'm good with all of the hardware, thanks. I finally decided to go with the crank pulley bolt as the front attachment also. I found a long bolt, drilled a hole in a piece of wood to move everything outwards, cranked it home. Worked well.

 

What didn't work so well was my attempt to get the engine onto the workbench so I could finish the flywheel etc. and mate it to the gearbox. I ended up with the hoist on its side and the engine laying on the shop floor! I was very fortunate that it didn't land on me as well. Apparently the flight reflex is still firing pretty well. The "I'm an idiot" reflex too.

 

Damage appears to be manageable, but firing things up will be the ultimate test of that. One thing is certain -- my fancy oil pan now has a fancy dent.

[IamScotticus]

Ooooh!  A teachable moment!

please give us a pic of the hoist used.  My future engine plucking plan is a gantry hoist.

[wdb]

It wasn't the tool's fault that the crash happened, it was mine entirely. I was too clever by half.

 

It's a Harbor Freight 'cherry picker' hoist. It's decently made. Harbor Freight seems to have upped their game recently in terms of quality. 

 

https://www.harborfreight.com/automotive/lifts-cranes-stands/2-ton-capacity-foldable-shop-crane-58755.html

 

 

I suspect it is a common complaint with this style of hoist, but it doesn't extend very far. The problem I was trying to solve when everything came tumbling down was how to get the engine over top of the workbench. Afterwards I realized I had a rolling table, which I tend to forget about because it sits next to the workbench, looks just like the workbench, and gets used mostly as an extension of the workbench.  Hindsight is wonderful.

[CharlesG]

I built a gantry hoist to pull the engine out of my car. After it was out, I put it on an elevating cart so I could work on it.

[fastg]

I use the same HF setup. I have to put the Honda engine in at an extrema downwards angle. I remove the leveling tool crank handle and welded on a 19mm nut. Then I can use power tool to adjust the angle of attach, much easier. 

 

Graham 

[IamScotticus]

Although a $6-700 gantry is a huge investment, and makes more sense for a professional outfit (planning for the future), I have read many times of issues using "cherry pickers" on sevens that have been problem fraught.  I saw how one fellow had to extend the boom so far, the rear legs needed extra weight added to keep from tipping.

It would probably less of an issue for 7s up on wheel ramps where the legs can roll between the wheels, but chassis stands tend to get in the way. 

[MV8]

The legs extend just like the boom and must be extended at least as much as the boom. I have a much older model that has served me well. Only four wheels, no handlebar, different clamps and probably heavier.

 

I'd put it on the floor to install the flywheel.

[wdb]

I wish the legs on my hoist extended/retracted but they don't. 

 

I got the engine off the floor and onto the rolling workbench. Flywheel, clutch assembly, transmission is mated back up. I purchased a transmission jack when the lift went in, thinking it would be handy for all kinds of things under vehicles -- which it has been. It also came in handy when mating up the engine and transmission. You can see the wooden stands I cobbled together to keep things upright. A pile of scrap wood is pretty handy too! (Insert pack rat joke here.)

 

I had to get creative with one of the bell housing bolts because the relocated dipstick tube sits right in front of it. I solved that by extending the threads on a long bolt and cutting off the excess, then running it in from the bell housing side. I was then able to use a nut on the dipstick side. Also the lower plate piece between the engine and bell housing no longer fits due to the different oil pan; it isn't really needed because the pan covers most of the opening anyway. I am going to fab up a small piece to cover a gap on the driver's side. Then I think I'm ready to go back in.

 

In terms of the hoist and its reach to access the engine compartment: I didn't have a problem removing the engine and I don't anticipate having much trouble reinstalling engine/transmission. One concern is the entry angle. I have the levelling bar biased so that I should be able to get enough. The other fun part might be accessing the tail housing under the car in the event I need to jack it up as things progress. I hope to have the lift high enough that I can roll under there if the need arises. One good thing about this cherry picker is that it has a great deal of vertical range, which will come in handy.

 

 

[MV8]

I see that now. Started hunting for ones with extendable legs. I thought they were still standard. Another example of the decline.

 

I bought my hoist at a flea market where you'd find HBF sellers before they had stores. I think it was $150. It's identical to this one currently at $1200:

https://www.northerntool.com/products/omega-engine-hoist-2-ton-capacity-model-44020-112351

[IamScotticus]

An old trick is to chock the front wheels and jack up the rear really high, angle in the eng while lowering the chasis as you feed the tail through the tunnel.  then with the eng and trans mounts still loose, raise again to instal the shaft.

Keep the mounts loose until all ancillaries are installed for intake and exhaust positioning when on the ground.

More than helpful...

 

Edited May 22, 2023 by IamScotticus

[wdb]

Engine is in, petro fluids are in. I have oil pressure, w00t! Took a while to come up; I cranked for a few secs, waited, cranked a few more. A bunch of times. Pics later maybe, it was a busy time and my hands were gloved and/or greasy. Just now my fingers ache. I need some Weber carb gas line seals because these are leaking. And then we will add fire. 

[Vinman1]

wdb,

 

Congrats on getting to this point, seeing the engine in, and the reality of making it breath fire very soon, is a great milestone on these car build adventures!

 

Cheers,

 

V

[wdb]

Some pictures this time. 

• I had plenty of vertical space to work with, even with the lift up high enough to allow me to creeper underneath if needs be.
• The leveling bar tilts one way at the same time the hoist arm tilts the other way, and they collide, plus it was a challenge to operate the crank. I angled the hoist a few degrees to alleviate the issue. I would put the leveling crank on the back side next time. I might also put a clevis between the leveler and the hoist, to add some space there.
• Also the reach thing again; the hoist was hard up against the front of the car. Angling the hoist gave me another couple of inches.
• Going in from the side was not an option with the car on a 4-post lift, but that would have solved both of the above problems.
• There was no need to go under the car for any reason. There was ample clearance to ease the whole works back and down while keeping the transmission above the crossmember.
• The block of wood on the crank pulley made things very tight at the front end of the engine. I had to let the engine down and re-do that connection in order to gain forward clearance.
• There is a TON of access on these little lovelies, from every angle. As I was reassembling things I worked my way up from the bottom of the engine to the top, all from above. I almost never had to go underneath for engine related assembly.

 

[Vinman1]

The x cross member in front of the engine helps. Mine does not have it, so I had slit a piece black irrigation pipe to protect it. Glad I did, since I had the engine in an out five times. 

[wdb]

It fired up. Wasn’t happy. Throttle and choke cable intricacies. The damned radiator still leaks from exactly the same damned place. I will throw money at that, no point in doing otherwise. I’m also 99.997% certain that my oil pan gasket cobble is a fail. Dry sump in my future. In the meantime my webers no longer spew fuel all over the sparky bits, and my speedometer still works!
 

I need my lift back, and I very much need a drive in my little yellow. Both come soon, leaks be damned.
 

Still need a donor shift lever. The amount that needs to be chopped off is considerable and the outcome is in question. A MkII Cortina went up on BaT last week and after poring over the pics that is definitely my gearbox. For now I will continue to be discreet with my fingers when going into first.