Deman USA Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 im not saying this to have someone feel bad, im just saying that it seems that we are never really brought up in any talk. i know that we are a new company, and we dont have any cars on the road for anybody to talk highly of them, but we dont get any support it seems like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusaNostra Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 im not saying this to have someone feel bad, im just saying that it seems that we are never really brought up in any talk. i know that we are a new company, and we dont have any cars on the road for anybody to talk highly of them, but we dont get any support it seems like. Come on Deman (I) we support you just like any brand here. Don't be too sensitive. I got Westfield, if I need parts that I can cross reference using Deman or any other brand, I don't mind using it. I'm not into "my car is better than yours" when it comes to 7. We all came here as one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnCh Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 im not saying this to have someone feel bad, im just saying that it seems that we are never really brought up in any talk. i know that we are a new company, and we dont have any cars on the road for anybody to talk highly of them, but we dont get any support it seems like. I think there are two reasons, one of which you highlight above "we dont have any cars on the road..." As Mazda pointed out earlier, people tend to gravitate towards the manufacturer whose car they have purchased. If you don’t have any customers with cars on the road, then you won’t find many singing your praises based on first-hand experience. Second, you are a frequent poster on the forum and many of those posts are a bit like advertising. I'm not criticizing, but when I look at the various manufacturers, I think you are the only one who posts as such. Therefore, I don’t think it would occur to many people to jump in on your behalf because you aren’t being represented. Dino, I like what I see with the Deman. There are some interesting design elements, and I’m glad you contribute here. However – and speaking strictly for myself – when I hear a manufacturer publicly complaining on this marque inclusive forum that they aren’t receiving sufficient support, it is a big turn off. It is really interesting that this thread, which started out with someone posting a new design for a se7en, has taken two rather strange tangents. Al, we may need you to step in again as the former President. Or perhaps the current President could step in this time? -John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slngsht Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 Dino, I like what I see with the Deman. There are some interesting design elements, and I’m glad you contribute here. However – and speaking strictly for myself – when I hear a manufacturer publicly complaining on this marque inclusive forum that they aren’t receiving sufficient support, it is a big turn off. It is really interesting that this thread, which started out with someone posting a new design for a se7en, has taken two rather strange tangents. Al, we may need you to step in again as the former President. Or perhaps the current President could step in this time? -John Funny, I was just commenting to my nephew the other day about how surprised I was when I saw people forwarding the pictures to various manufacturers. Very enthusiastic indeed - and there is nothing wrong with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestTexasS2K Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 Dino I dont think anyone was being malitias with intent of leaving you out of the discussion. They just were naming some of the more widely known names. Because anyone that has seen the Deman cant say that it isnt a very nice car. I was very impressed with the quality of your car when I saw it at R&G and Kevin raves about how solid the car felt when he drove it. Your car is just a little newer to the market and hasnt been seen as much as some of the others. Keep up the hard work in 5 years people will be putting the Deman in there with the rest group. Dont take it personally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 Thanks for nobody offering to let us(Deman USA or B.A.M) know about this 7. It seems as though we are always left out. Its always a Caterham,Westfeild,Birkin, or most of all a WCM thing. So much for a couple of kids trying to start a business. Thank you and Happy New Year. Dino Trakas B.A.M USA :confused: Your car name was mentioned in the first reply to this topic. Actually, it is the very first word of the first reply to this topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwar1000 Posted January 2, 2008 Author Share Posted January 2, 2008 Deman USA do you have a website I could check out?? I can do logo design, websites, and full vehicle designs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue Se7ens Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I'm new to this group and have found some of the banter interesting, but taking a couple steps back, as a builder and composites guy, I have been thinking of modeling a modern 7 and offering the car and the composite parts for locost builders, but will people buy it? Most seem to support the traditional look, though some companies have strayed some in their finished models offered, will home builders buy the 'body' parts for such a car? www.roguese7ens.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusaNostra Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 "but will people buy it? Most seem to support the traditional look" My 2cents. Let's be honest, there is no purity on the so called "lotus 7" since the man stopped producing his 7. When I go to shows and races, I don't call my car a Lotus 7. Atom & others is probably a concept taken from the genius Colin Chapman. Atom is a modern concept, therefore I don't mind having a modern day 7. If I want traditional, I will buy a pure Lotus super 7... ha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slngsht Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I'm new to this group and have found some of the banter interesting, but taking a couple steps back, as a builder and composites guy, I have been thinking of modeling a modern 7 and offering the car and the composite parts for locost builders, but will people buy it? Most seem to support the traditional look, though some companies have strayed some in their finished models offered, will home builders buy the 'body' parts for such a car? www.roguese7ens.com It's hard to say, because there are so many of us who have arrived at our particular se7ens from various perspectives. I'm pretty sure you will have a tough time if you're a start up and whatever you build ends up costing as much as a Caterham. The opening in this market is definitely sub 30K, perhaps sub 20K for a startup. But that's just my opinion, and I'm a cheap bastard The design at the start of this thread has captured alot of interest because it is fresh and different, yet unmistakably seven. Not easy to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwar1000 Posted January 2, 2008 Author Share Posted January 2, 2008 http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/upload/183704878_7b.jpg heres another quick one for the day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestTexasS2K Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 gwar1000 are you doing the designs for this car? These are really nice renderings. Are you drawing them or using asome type of cad system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwar1000 Posted January 2, 2008 Author Share Posted January 2, 2008 I draw them in photoshop. I'm still learning the program Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestTexasS2K Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 looks like you got it down pretty good to me. Sent you a PM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwar1000 Posted January 2, 2008 Author Share Posted January 2, 2008 PM sent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue Se7ens Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Lets say people are interested and that people will buy the parts, kit, or car, where do we start in the design? I make a basic replica lotus frame and reproduction fiberglass parts and have worked at some updated parts that will gradually be appearing on my site. So do we start with a "stock chassis" re-engineered similar to Caterham, or go wider, longer, taller, then suspension, drive train, etc. It appears to me that if I were to invest in producing a modern lotus, though I love the renderings, the looks are only one aspect of the design. Or would I just make parts that will fit my frame, look modern, and sell them to others to modify as they like? Is there such a community surrounding all "kit cars"? I share a shop and supply composite parts for a company that builds Cobras. They build a frame, fiberglass body, and suspension very close to the original. For some that is the only way to have a Cobra, but the fact is that Factory Five sells many more a year and their car is nothing like the original. Is it only price, marketing, or demand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slngsht Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 start by seeing who will be driving these things. If your typical customer is 230 lbs, wears size 11 shoes and is over 6 feet (exaggerating a little), starting with a standard sized seven is probably a bad choice. Look around the forum. Frequently you'll see someone come in asking about height, footwell, etc... and the answer they get is you have to get a REALLY short haircut, and drive with your socks (again, exaggerating). next, look at the choice of drivetrains. Stick with what's cheap, light, easily obtained, easy to mod. It sounds sexy on paper to list a 15000 rpm redline and 8 turbos, but do you really measurably go any faster? owners are always free to up the power after they get the car. The basic car should be capable, but mainstream, especially for a startup operation. I've been on a handful of drives with a few members here. a 140hp Caterham will keep up with the higher performance versions just fine for spirited driving. I suspect even on the track, it's plenty of fun. follow the KISS principal. For 50-60K, there are plenty of REALLY capable techno cars in the market. The seven is a throwback car, and its simplicity is one of its strengths. Keep it cheap, reasonable quality. Details are huge. Nice fitting doors and top don't make the car faster, but will make for happy owners. Personally (many opinions on this topic on the forum), I think it's a plus to have a distinctive look. It may make it harder in the beginning, but if business takes off, you're not just a copycat. Nobody mistakes a WCM, Stalker, or Dino's Deman with the side pods for a Caterham. If your car is engineered right, and owners have success at autox or road racing, the distinctive look is a definite advantage. Drawing a parallel to factory five, they have a proven product now... It takes years to build that base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusaLoco Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 What do you think that Colin would say if he were reading this discussion. I rather doubt that he would be interested in whether the car were uncomfortable, hot and unstylish! I recon that he would do a whole lot less talking (especially about style) and find more ways to add lightness ... (using a bike engine of course). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slngsht Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 What do you think that Colin would say if he were reading this discussion. I recon that he would do a whole lot less talking (especially about style) and find more ways to add lightness ... (using a bike engine of course). If he came alive today and looked around, he would say HOLY CRAP! They put 650HP engines in production cars that pull over 1G and do over 200 MPH? WITH CUPHOLDERS? WTF!?!?!?! :jester: Seriously, lightness is just part of the formula. Come to think of it, look at the path he took. He always innovated, and the progression in his designs show it. From going mid-engine to aero innovation - he constantly innovated. I doubt he would care much for building the same design year after year. But even though Colin may think highly of it, perhaps being on the bleeding edge is not the smartest thing for a startup trying to make it in the US kit car market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue Se7ens Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Back to the original subject, if we would drive a modern 7, what is it that we like about the renderings. I personally like the conical shape of the rear fenders and the contrasting color, that's pretty easy to provide, though the shape of the cone looks a little extreme for a standard size frame and say 16" wheels. I also like the forward slant of the roll bar and the way is blends nicely with the body, especially the double hoop, again this can be done. I think the side pods are cool, weather for exhaust of just looks. I have done a lot of aerodynamic parts for other cars and I think these could provide aero benefits too. The vents look nice and seem to add some practical value. I think one rendering had integrated mirrors, nice touch. I think the nose could be a little refined, and a few aero devices added (splitter, winglets...). Overall it could be done on most any existing frame. I may start playing with a Solidworks model based on one of my frames, but I would like to know what features are must haves, and what needs to go. www.roguese7ens.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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