yellowss7 Posted August 23, 2011 Share Posted August 23, 2011 Yes and you had to "refresh" (aka rebuild) the engine every 20,000 miles. That sounds a little too highly strung for me.... Well, Caterham call it "The SUMO VERSION" its what was on the Manufacturer Certificate of Origin, and it is only slightly short of the 500hp per ton. And it is a definitely a FAT BASTARD now that it is undergoing some weight shedding and a carbon beauty treatment and dust control measures. Fixed that for you. :jester: As for the 20,000 mile rebuild, It's way more track miles than any of us will ever do. IMHO. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Croc Posted August 23, 2011 Share Posted August 23, 2011 Fixed that for you. :jester: As for the 20,000 mile rebuild, It's way more track miles than any of us will ever do. IMHO. Tom The 20,000 miles refresh on the R500 K engine was for road. Track miles was much less. Either way it was still a screamer of an engine to rev up to 8800. Almost like the more reliable Honda S2000 engine that makes more power for less hassle.... My car is not called Fat Bastard. I call it Toe Cutter - it rolls over your toes and and cuts them off! :jester: Did that to myself last weekend.... :ack: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onken Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 Stock Duratec makes abt 140 hp, like a stock Zetec, and way more than an X-flow. Shd be plenty of hp for a se7en, except for the power crazy crowd (like me). Dick Brink told me pays $700 for them. Here in europe we have a 2L 175bhp version, I would go for that one. I've already drive one (Caterham R300 Duratec EU spec, not UK spec) and it's very nice, very smooth, in fact a bit too smooth for me. You don't have this kind of kit at 4000RPM which is nice and gives more caracter to the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onken Posted August 25, 2011 Share Posted August 25, 2011 (edited) Yes Mike, the Rover K series did suffer from head gasket issues if you still had the original plastic dowels and if your liner heights were not the required 2-3 thousands above the deck. A good engine builder knows of these issues and they are easily rectified. My red line is 8000 and while I don't get to it in 6th, I don't really need to as I have to slow way down to get by you when you create such big dust storms at NJMP. :smilielol5: The original R500's were Rover Kseries, and they are still considered as quick as the R500 Duratecs. But then again the R500's rev to 8800rpm. Now that's scary. http://www.minister-power.com/ Click on Engines, then MG/Rover and view the different power options. This is the motor that led to the desiganation of SUPERLIGHT. The R500's had a power to weight ratio of 500 HP per Ton. As for you CSR claiming the Superlight moniker...:smilielol5: Tom The Rover K is commun here in France and in UK, if you keep it full stock, is still fine for road use, on track with sticky tire, you'll have oil pressure problem on long right corner (even with harder tire in fact). So you'll need dry sump etc. If you need more power and still reliable, keep under 8000rpm and 200BHP, over you'll have to rebuild your engine often (15 000 to 20 000 miles for both track and road use) Edited August 25, 2011 by Onken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowss7 Posted August 25, 2011 Share Posted August 25, 2011 The Rover K is commun here in France and in UK, if you keep it full stock, is still fine for road use, on track with sticky tire, you'll have oil pressure problem on long right corner (even with harder tire in fact). So you'll need dry sump etc. If you need more power and still reliable, keep under 8000rpm and 200BHP, over you'll have to rebuild your engine often (15 000 to 20 000 miles for both track and road use) Yep,Exactly right. Mine is dry sumped, has 195 hp and as Croc has witnessed, there is no need to bang it off the rev limiter. This is just for fun, it's not racing. :cheers: Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kennyrayandersen Posted August 28, 2011 Share Posted August 28, 2011 I don't know... 1500 Lb and 400 HP (LS-3 Al block and heads) looks pretty tempting and it's not THAT heavy. LOL That's bone stock. With Birkins etc weighing in at 1350-1400 or so you aren't trading so much weight for the extra HP. I don't think one should rule out the V-8 just because it's got too many cylinders. One thing to take into account is fully loaded power-to-weight. Lest say you build a 1300 Lb 7 with a 200 HP Duratec (or whatever). Drop in 2, 200 lb guys (funner with a friend) you get 8.5 Lb/HP. With a 1500 Stalker (or whatever) with a 400 HP LS-3 you drop in an extra 400 Lb for passengers, you still get 4.8 Lb HP. In other words the extra passenger weight makes a bigger impact on a lower HP lower weight car. Now, admittedly, if you are spending big money to wring 300+ HP out of the Duratec, then, OK, but then you got a pretty high-strung setup. Don't get me wrong, I like both approaches, but it doesn't seem quite as awful as some make it sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onken Posted August 29, 2011 Share Posted August 29, 2011 I don't know... 1500 Lb and 400 HP (LS-3 Al block and heads) looks pretty tempting and it's not THAT heavy. LOL That's bone stock. With Birkins etc weighing in at 1350-1400 or so you aren't trading so much weight for the extra HP. I don't think one should rule out the V-8 just because it's got too many cylinders. One thing to take into account is fully loaded power-to-weight. Lest say you build a 1300 Lb 7 with a 200 HP Duratec (or whatever). Drop in 2, 200 lb guys (funner with a friend) you get 8.5 Lb/HP. With a 1500 Stalker (or whatever) with a 400 HP LS-3 you drop in an extra 400 Lb for passengers, you still get 4.8 Lb HP. In other words the extra passenger weight makes a bigger impact on a lower HP lower weight car. Now, admittedly, if you are spending big money to wring 300+ HP out of the Duratec, then, OK, but then you got a pretty high-strung setup. Don't get me wrong, I like both approaches, but it doesn't seem quite as awful as some make it sound. There is several points to look at. If you go for a V8 (not based on 2 bike engines), you'll get more torque, more power and more weight. more torque and more power you'll need a stiffer chassis (obviously heavier), you'll also need bigger brakes (again heavier), then you'll need wider tire to get good traction and good brakes (once again heavier), more fuel consumption for the V8 so bigger fuel tank unless you want to refuel every 80 miles. and so on Let's say that your chassis, brakes etc are still fine for your heavy V8. The V8 will always be heavier and longer than a 4 cylinders. This mean than you'll have a different weight balance with the V8 (more weight and more in front). I've you ever driven a Caterham HPC with the 2L Opel/Vauxall and driven a 1600K, you'll fill the difference after 2 turns because of the 30 to 40Kg of weight difference and both are 4 cylinders. A Duratec with "only" 220 BHP is already increadibly fast if you have the write chassis, well balanced and the driving skill. Almost all of us should spend more $$$ on driving lesson than spending on more BHP (me ahead) but that's another thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Croc Posted August 29, 2011 Share Posted August 29, 2011 Almost all of us should spend more $$$ on driving lesson than spending on more BHP (me ahead) but that's another thread. But it is more fun spending money on go faster engine pieces, carbon fiber and other goodies which generally do not improve performance much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blubarisax Posted August 29, 2011 Share Posted August 29, 2011 So Croc, I think you need to start a thread on carbon fiber goodies! I can't wait to see the CSR with the Exige GT3 rear spoiler wing and front splitter from ReVerie!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Croc Posted August 29, 2011 Share Posted August 29, 2011 No rear wing as it screwed up front/rear balance (made the front light again) when we tested it in the wind tunnel. Still testing the wing when placed on the front like the Levante did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowss7 Posted August 29, 2011 Share Posted August 29, 2011 No rear wing as it screwed up front/rear balance (made the front light again) when we tested it in the wind tunnel. Still testing the wing when placed on the front like the Levante did. Wind Tunnel Testing? Are you trying to determine a way to keep the dust storms you create from getting into your car, or do you think that your new aeroscreen will allow it to just sweep up and over your helmet?:rofl::rofl: You missed a nice day on Friday at NJMP. I did talk to a guy who said he was interested in renting the track out, and mentioned that if we can get the 7's together again, he could get a few of his associates together and we could rent the track out reasonalbly without overcrowding. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midgetracr Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 Just curious. How much do the good, hi power 4 cylinder engines weigh and cost? Also what is the engine of choice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestTexasS2K Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 S2000 engine tranny is about 460 lbs. Stock junk yard motor 2600-4500 with trans depending on mileage. Built stroker with fuel mgmt 8-12 k engine only. Power adder to stock engine w fuel mgmt will be close to 10k with head studs and upgraded head gasket w valve springs and retainers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onken Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 A 2L Duratec engine or a 2.3L 2L more rev 2.3L more torque About same power about same price with 220/230BHP. 2L is lower than the 2.3L so easyier to fit. http://www.cosworthusa.com/store/pc/viewCategories.asp?idCategory=20 http://www.minister-power.com/engines/index.htm The 2L from Honda S2000 is very heavy about 120/130Kg so 30/40 more than a Duratec or Rover. About price, it depends of what you need... Engine Engine + aux (starter + flywheel + clutch + alternator) Engine + aux + fixation Engine + aux + fixation + management (ECU) etc Engine + aux + fixation + management (ECU) + installation in the car Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestTexasS2K Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Oops i put the wrong weight. The Honda F 20c w tranny should be about 418lbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitcat Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Migetracr: What does your V8 engine/tranny weigh/cost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onken Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 (edited) Oops i put the wrong weight. The Honda F 20c w tranny should be about 418lbs. 418lbs really? that's 189Kg means 100Kg (220lbs) more than a Duratec or a Rover. Edited September 2, 2011 by Onken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onken Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Migetracr: What does your V8 engine/tranny weigh/cost? have a look on RS Performance website: http://www.rsperformance.co.uk/ I've seen a while ago a new V8 from RS performance (500BHP version) for sale due to cancel order at 25 000£. It was on pistonheads.co.uk. There is a Caterham Levante in France, it's very very fast in strait line. But the car was often back to the dealer due to minor problems (lack of developpement). It seem to be better now. http://www.rsperformance.co.uk/levante_technicalspecification.htm 500+bhp and 300lbsft on 520Kg Caterham SV chassis... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestTexasS2K Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 418lbs is engine and trans with all the accessories. The Honda six speed is pretty heavy trans compared to T9. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midgetracr Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 My complete 6.2L/376 cubic inch (all aluminum) LS3 engine weighs 357 lbs. This does not include bellhousing, aluminum flywheel, clutch, headers, oil or water. This also does not include the dry sump pumps which I estimate to be less than 15 lbs. Don't have the trans, bellhousing, flywheel or clutch weights available where I am at now. The engine is lighter than the cast iron supercharged V6 that it replaced. Now that it is properly tuned, the engine makes over 500 HP and 480 ft lbs of torque at the crankshaft. It is stock inside except for the valve springs and rod bolts that have been replaced in the interests of long term reliability. RPM is limited electronically to 7000. The engine came from GM new with a 50,000 mile or 24 month warranty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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