FIA bar headaches

[supersportsp]

So, I ordered an FIA bar for the Caterham this past summer and it took some time to get here (October). I was a little concerned with the forward lean of the bar, but that was more from a cosmetic standpoint than anything else. Then I installed it. And the uh, oh's ensued.

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v715/tgodbout/photo6.jpg

 

As you can see, not exactly a lot of clearance between my soft head bits, and the very hard FIA bar bits. I am lacking the headrests on my stock Caterham seats, and originally I thought they might do the trick to protect me from the bar but was skeptical. Then I had my wife take these photos of me sitting in the car. The one that really made think this was not going to work was this one.

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v715/tgodbout/photo5.jpg

 

Basically zero clearance with the helmet on. I could maybe fit a 1/4" pad between the helmet on the bar. After sending these to Ben at Caterham USA he still seems to think that I should be able to use the headrests to protect me from the bar, but I don't see how, even with the 1/2 versions (https://www.caterhamparts.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=114&products_id=4610&osCsid=bef0da154380459ce9b1b3f11ca49579) that this will work.

 

Thoughts from any other FIA bar owners? I am 6'2" which makes this more of a challenge.

[yellowss7]

Supersport, are you using the standard seat bottoms? Or have you tried to lower your postion by taking the bottom sqab out or going with the lowered floors?

 

It looks like if you can get a little lower it would give you more room.

 

I'm 6' 1" and I was using a thin piece of foam to get lower, but last year I made a foam bead seat that looks good and provides good support and kept me lower. I have the standard size head rests, but do notice them a little with the helmet on. However, that being said, I did pick up a tall FIA bar to give me a couple more inches of clearance. Haven't installed it yet though.

 

Tom

[scannon]

I have the FIA bar on my SV. I'm 5'8" so I don't have the problem you have, my head is safely below the top bar. I do have to remove the headrest when wearing a helmet as the headrest pushes my head forward and down, a very uncomfortable position for driving.

 

Caterham makes an adjustable helmet stop that clamps to the cross bars on the FIA bar. It does not come with padding so you have to do that yourself or outsource it.

[turboeric]

I'd strongly recommend padding that bar so that you don't suffer the ironic end of being killed by your safety equipment. Normal SFI 45.1 padding is designed for cushioning impacts by helmets, not unprotected noggins. The "pipe insulation" style padding you frequently see, isn't tough enough to sustain a helmet impact. For a car driven both with and without a helmet, the best product that I'm aware of is the dual durometer padding that BSCI sells. Roll Bar Padding If you've ever looked at slow motion video of crashes, it's astonishing how much the head moves around. From your pictures, you will definitely contact the bar in a crash.

[Hank]

Damn I don't like the looks of that bar at all.

 

I do envy your "chops" though.

http://images0.cpcache.com/product/yellow-smilie-smiley/243521110v4_225x225_Front.jpg

[S1Steve]

That FIA bar makes me want to cut that thing apart and fix it !!!!

[supersportsp]

I have the FIA bar on my SV. I'm 5'8" so I don't have the problem you have, my head is safely below the top bar. I do have to remove the headrest when wearing a helmet as the headrest pushes my head forward and down, a very uncomfortable position for driving.

 

Caterham makes an adjustable helmet stop that clamps to the cross bars on the FIA bar. It does not come with padding so you have to do that yourself or outsource it.

 

The issue isn't the height of the bar necessarily, it is the intrusion into the cockpit. At 5'8" and in an SV, I don't imagine you have the seat all the way back. In an S3 with the seat all the way back and the FIA bar, it actually protrudes into the vertical plane of the cockpit several inches at the top thanks to the forward lean.

 

Between having the seat all the way back and sitting higher in the cockpit due to the length of my torso, My head is very, very close to both the triangular bar and the top bar. With my helmet on it is basically in contact with it. I looked into the adjustable head rest attachments from the bar, but after analyzing the space I have available, I am not sure it would even work without the helmet on.

 

I haven't driven the car more than from my house to my other garage 4 blocks away as I am well aware that even a slow impact would cause my noggin to smack very hard steel.

 

I really don't understand why Caterham designed the cage with so much forward lean, especially for the S3 chassis. Granted, I am on the very upper limit on height for someone who fits in an S3, but still.

[Kitcat]

I think they designed the FIA bar with the forward lean so as to still be able to use the top.

 

Perhaps lower the seats/drop the floors?

 

My stock cloth seat fit with the headrest on, even shoved all the way back (the headrest just squeezed under the upper bar-with a little pushing on my part). Ditto my Tilet seat.

 

At 5'9" my head is a long way from the bar. I run w/a full harness which, hopefully, will keep my head away from the bar in the event of an accident. Not so sure the 3 point belt wld do that.

[Croc]

There are two directions you can move to solve this - down or forward. I second the Tom's bead seat idea - that can get you an inch lower. Also moving to a tillet shell would get you lower. Lowered floors also takes 1-1.5 inches out. I am sure you have tried moving forward a notch so the forward option really does not work.

 

I am 5'11 and tried the half head rest on standard seats in an S3 with FIA cage in November in the UK and found it was ok for me with helmet on. However I am a notch forward on the seats than your position from looking at the photos. I also tried a regular seat head rest and that was a no go with helmet as you discovered.

 

Two other options:

1) Caterham used to sell a head rest/padded cradle that mounted directly to the roll bar not to the seat. I used to use one on my first Seven in vintage racing. I cannot see it online but it probably still exists

2) Caterham also sell FIA bar padding

https://www.caterhamparts.co.uk/product_info.php?products_id=3737&osCsid=e184e6aa1ad5ada016bd9ed5fa7b1c54

Edited December 12, 2010 by Croc

[supersportsp]

I think they designed the FIA bar with the forward lean so as to still be able to use the top.

 

Perhaps lower the seats/drop the floors?

 

My stock cloth seat fit with the headrest on, even shoved all the way back (the headrest just squeezed under the upper bar-with a little pushing on my part). Ditto my Tilet seat.

 

At 5'9" my head is a long way from the bar. I run w/a full harness which, hopefully, will keep my head away from the bar in the event of an accident. Not so sure the 3 point belt wld do that.

 

Kitcat, it looks like (from your avatar) that you are running the older style FIA bar. The newer one which is on my car has double cross bracing.

 

They are subtly different in dimension and the newer bar also has a double cross brace. I am not sure how much more or less yours intrudes into the cockpit.

 

 

I tried taking my seat bottom out and sitting in the car last night. It lowered me slightly, but after measuring the seat bottom on the stock seats and figuring in compression, I am only sitting 1-1.25" off the floor with the stock seat. It also had the rather unexpected effect of making the cockpit feel shorter. I believe this is because the back wall of the passenger compartment slopes rather significantly (60 degrees) so each inch I lower myself in the stock floors, I actually move my butt closer to the pedals.

[Jon W.]

You may a have an FIA reg rollbar, but it results in an unapproved installation relative to your head height. I believe you need 50mm clearance from top of bar to top of helmet. So your options or combinations of options are:

 

1. Lower existing seat bottom and thin seat back to reclaim leg room. Install head support plate on bar. Pad bar.

 

2. Install extended FIA rollbar (if there is clearance for your top) and head plate.

 

3. Cut up existing bar to rotate to more vertical position to gain more fore-aft clearance, install padded head plate on bar. (Four cuts, back brace shortening, change angle on main hoop bases, rewelding.) Doesn't solve height problem.

 

4. Replace cushy seat with a thinner highback seat to gain lower bottom and retain legroom. Install 5 pt harness to keep your head centered and therfore away from contact with bar on sides of headrest. (No bar changes.)

 

5. Sell rollbar and have a new one fabbed to maximize height/angle/clearance. Any decent fab shop can make you one.

[Hudson]

I think you will end up with either a custom bar or you could try this

 

https://www.caterhamparts.co.uk/product_info.php?products_id=1139&osCsid=4eef83c174a0f00da97260a4c7381c10

[blubarisax]

I have the same issue being 6'6". I have the FIA X style bar, regular headrests and lowered floors and I am ok without a helmet. I understand from Caterham that they no longer make the tall FIA roll bars. I've been thinking about having my roll bar extended a few inches so I can meet the regulations on the track.

[senda212]

so many useful information!:driving: