New guy. Here is my Cat

[Vovchandr]

So my lack of power in the car and the comment by the tuner that it's chocking even though it's on ITBs made me reconsider my velocity stack arrangement. 

 

The ones on there now are slightly smaller than the runners and aren't OEM, but were rather a quick fix and were welded on. 

 

So here comes the fun

 

 

[Vovchandr]

While this is unlikely to fix my power problems it made me feel better 

 

 

[MV8]

Those look great. Did your car come with the adjustable cam pulleys? Were they "dialed in" as Dallasdude described or just lined up? Nothing wrong with 140hp depending on the chassis dyno, dyno calibration, weather correction, and other little details.

[Vovchandr]

1 hour ago, MV8 said:

Those look great. Did your car come with the adjustable cam pulleys? Were they "dialed in" as Dallasdude described or just lined up? Nothing wrong with 140hp depending on the chassis dyno, dyno calibration, weather correction, and other little details.

 

Did not come with the pulleys. Got them on per advice of tuner before I went down there. 

 

I'd be somewhat more ok with those numbers but Tom is the absolute East coast guru for Zetecs and he was very perplexed as to why it was under performing. He expected it to put down around 170 wheel which is honestly what I was sort of expecting as well. 

 

Before he did his magic with the the, the engine was actually part of "double digit dyno" club. 

[Vovchandr]

On 11/28/2022 at 4:38 PM, Vovchandr said:

 

Thank you for that info. I'll be less concerned about new filter going unoiled. 

 

It was less than direct to find a replacement but ordered the same unit except they switched to plastic for inside structure now

 

 

 

 

 

Appears that one I've ordered might have been too tall 

[Vovchandr]

Pretty sure my Cylinder #4 is misfiring. Temperatures on it are reading drastically colder than the rest

 

#1 450

#2 500

#3 475

#4 250

 

Also the sound is of a slight misfire

 

Switch the coils between 1 and 4 due to the wasted spark trick and still no change.

 

Going to do another compression and leakdown test, take a look at the spark plug etc

[MV8]

Plug wires are often carbon core which breaks down with age and use. That is the first place I'd look. I usually assemble spiral wound, solid wire / inductive suppression wires when able as they don't break down and have much less resistance per foot so the plug gaps can be widened and starting is easier. You may have proprietary terminals that would prevent building your own. NGK makes good replacement sets.

 

[Vovchandr]

37 minutes ago, MV8 said:

Plug wires are often carbon core which breaks down with age and use. That is the first place I'd look. I usually assemble spiral wound, solid wire / inductive suppression wires when able as they don't break down and have much less resistance per foot so the plug gaps can be widened and starting is easier. You may have proprietary terminals that would prevent building your own. NGK makes good replacement sets.

 

 

Pretty sure I replaced them a few years ago but will definitely give them another look while troubleshooting now. 

 

.

[MV8]

What brand is installed? Should say something on the leads. Should be the same resistance per foot for each to get an idea of the condition. Also, the boots eventually start arcing to the head instead of the plug and it can be hard to tell looking at the boots. The first one to fail is usually the shortest wire (#4) because it has the lowest resistance and delivers the most to the plug. I believe NGK 52028 are the right wires for your engine: https://www.ebay.com/itm/363800225369?epid=75440564&hash=item54b42ee659:g:3SgAAOSwgPditI6s&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA4KD%2FyCUsuLWn8klxIB45ocNmPF7ppA92ieLj4dmJkKrcR9aXNpX8iUpJE0W97HVVWjmpuaQJMOMw5GDJ6Y4DdIR2cGyNrxg9Sui3WTgvbaKaHKkt94W2NxNP5PyiRtcR4RoXQcUnyuyz83%2F1Tnp6rpryFprv6c67nBYFkH9Z%2F5f%2B%2Bhsy0HhCdw1as%2FgGOF8sicS%2BtgvvdSnkoaFdiboOvx%2BRuPzBMN13Osoo5%2Fy00szLAVfnYmPB7Rge9zt3SHK85PFrLvYfMRAXTYRYhLsJfp78apHgihG%2BJFf%2BzbsTo4IX|tkp%3ABk9SR4r-943-YQ

Edited May 6, 2023 by MV8

[Vovchandr]

3 hours ago, MV8 said:

What brand is installed? Should say something on the leads. Should be the same resistance per foot for each to get an idea of the condition. Also, the boots eventually start arcing to the head instead of the plug and it can be hard to tell looking at the boots. The first one to fail is usually the shortest wire (#4) because it has the lowest resistance and delivers the most to the plug. I believe NGK 52028 are the right wires for your engine: https://www.ebay.com/itm/363800225369?epid=75440564&hash=item54b42ee659:g:3SgAAOSwgPditI6s&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA4KD%2FyCUsuLWn8klxIB45ocNmPF7ppA92ieLj4dmJkKrcR9aXNpX8iUpJE0W97HVVWjmpuaQJMOMw5GDJ6Y4DdIR2cGyNrxg9Sui3WTgvbaKaHKkt94W2NxNP5PyiRtcR4RoXQcUnyuyz83%2F1Tnp6rpryFprv6c67nBYFkH9Z%2F5f%2B%2Bhsy0HhCdw1as%2FgGOF8sicS%2BtgvvdSnkoaFdiboOvx%2BRuPzBMN13Osoo5%2Fy00szLAVfnYmPB7Rge9zt3SHK85PFrLvYfMRAXTYRYhLsJfp78apHgihG%2BJFf%2BzbsTo4IX|tkp%3ABk9SR4r-943-YQ

They are not...

 

But congrats! You're officially an influencer...

 

Quick run to store fixes things 

 

Will test in a bit and report 

 

The ohm values didn't look friendly. They put out about 3.5k but went into NA once I wiggled it...

 

 

[MV8]

It almost feels like I have a cat! (garage first) Glad it worked out.

[IamScotticus]

1 hour ago, MV8 said:

It almost feels like I have a cat! (garage first) Glad it worked out.

 

1 hour ago, MV8 said:

It almost feels like I have a cat! (garage first)

Carcoon bubble?

[Vovchandr]

Looks like the end of the plugs are wrong for that plug wire kit. It seems to be a half year thing, no big deal. My ends either "clip on" or a wide enough not to slip off the coil pack terminals as is. New part #52099 for anybody readying this who needs this. No local available for that NGK so for now I'll get a temp regular replacement.

 

Also curious enough the resistance on NGK's is minimal compared to the other wires.

 

In the meantime also ordered a mechanical oil pressure gauge

 

Edited May 6, 2023 by Vovchandr

[MV8]

1 hour ago, IamScotticus said:

 

Carcoon bubble?

I'd never work on the garage on nice days with that kind of temptation sitting there.

[Vovchandr]

Swapped around the wires, moved around the injectors and still the same old same old. 

 

All have spark. #4 seems to run cold. Maybe a leak down test next...again. Maybe it's a cracked cylinder at the bottom of stroke and I'll never catch it. 

 

Either way wouldn't be surprised if I give up on this block by end of year. Don't have the time like I used to and frankly getting tired chasing the problem. 

 

@1turbofocus you have any SVTs laying around?

 

In meantime swapped around oil filters and found one that works half decent compared to what an OEM stock long one would be. 

 

Wix51374. Didn't like Wix51394 that some recommend because it was physically smaller on the gasket size and overall diameter. 

 

Good news is, so far no cooling issues but haven't driven on street yet this year. 

 

Also for the first time properly scribed the mark for what 5L of oil should look like on the dipstick without accessories of Accusump or oil cooler and the lines. Goes right through the letter L on "full"

Edited May 7, 2023 by Vovchandr

[1turbofocus]

7 minutes ago, Vovchandr said:

 

@1turbofocus you have any SVTs laying around?

 

Yes I have SVT Engines but looking at the Valve Cover on yours your running a ZX2 or Contour Zetec with VCT

 

[Vovchandr]

Just now, 1turbofocus said:

Yes I have SVT Engines but looking at the Valve Cover on yours your running a ZX2 or Con

 

Correct. I'd be swapping over to SVT from this, so a long block. I believe the ITB's should work on the SVT head as well. 

 

Worst case scenario, I'd settle for another Zetec. Not sure if you recall but the VCT has been disabled, so now it's just in the way. 

[Vovchandr]

Here's a video. You can clearly hear the misfire at idle and then I pull the plugs 1 by 1. When I pull cylinder 4 plug it starts to sound normal instead of the "wob wob wob" type firing I've had since pretty much I've owned the car. 

 

 

[1turbofocus]

Disables with Adj Cam gears ? The Zetec ITB you have will bolt up to the SVT Head but the runners dont line up properly

 

I would go to a Focus headed Zetec the cam choices are much better and you get rid of the VCT , ITB will bolt right up

 

The SVT isnt really a better option the Performance gain for the SVT came from the higher compression 10.2 vs 9.6 on thr Zetec , the SVT has much larger Cams , closer to stg2 or 3 Zetec and the SVT header alone was a 12whp gain , you can do the same with a Zetec , I have done it many times

 

Tom

 

[Vovchandr]

5 minutes ago, 1turbofocus said:

Disables with Adj Cam gears ? The Zetec ITB you have will bolt up to the SVT Head but the runners dont line up properly

 

I would go to a Focus headed Zetec the cam choices are much better and you get rid of the VCT , ITB will bolt right up

 

The SVT isnt really a better option the Performance gain for the SVT came from the higher compression 10.2 vs 9.6 on thr Zetec , the SVT has much larger Cams , closer to stg2 or 3 Zetec and the SVT header alone was a 12whp gain , you can do the same with a Zetec , I have done it many times

 

Tom

 

 

Yeah my VCT did nothing, even before I put on the the adjustable cam gears per your advice. 

 

I'm open to options. If I can have a more healthy regular Zetec with some head work I'd be happy for a direct 1:1 swap. Just don't want to go through this and dyno 130whp again even if it runs better. 

 

Napkin math says a "170" crank hp engine, with ITB's and a better header would do better than my Zetec.

 

I do have a quote from you saved from a long time ago explaining the differences to somebody

 

"I am sure you are happy with it , Take a Zetec 12.1 with the same mods you have and you will have the same HP # as you have now with weeks less work , money , headachs

Tha Zetec makes 130
The SVT makes 170

Thats a 40HP diff , 15 of that came from the header that been proven over and over again so that leaves 25HP , 10 came from the compression that leaves 15 , 5 came from the larger air box/snorkel , MAF and TB , That leaves 10hp , I feel an easy 5 of that came from the cams alone which leaves 5 HP

I have allways said that a good combination working and tuned properly makes for slightly more HP , I am taking that last 5 HP and giving that mostly to a good working combination and the head

I am very conservitive in my numbers above that I gave each part as you can see it leaves little performance coming from the head alone

I have allways said the SVT heads exh side is the same as the Zetec head , the intake side is very nice and flows well BUT it doesnt do much good on the intake side if the exh side cannot get enough out to let more in

Tom"

 

& this to another person. 

 

"Its worthless to install the SVT head on the zetec engine for more performance

Take the zetec you have , go to 10.0 compression , stg 2 cams with adj cam gears , SVT Inj , 65mm TB , a good tune and be done with it

Tom"