Scuttle removal?

[sltous]

2 hours ago, JohnCh said:

I didn't realize there are two more rivets that attach either side of the scuttle to the dash tube (thought those were small dome head screws.)  @sltous and @11Budlite how did you handle that?  Can you put a rivnut in that tube?

 

 

Thanks,

John 

Glad you asked and @11Budlite had an answer   I've been losing sleep about that rivnut.  I think I might put a countersunk head steel M3 or M4 nut in there.  Willing to take a tiny weight penalty for a more robust rivnut in a relatively hard to replace location.

[JohnCh]

If an M4 rivnut will fit in that location, I'm going that route.  The M4 button head diameter is the same as the rivet it replaces, so aesthetically it's a wash, and the M3 heads are a little too easy to strip in my experience.  But then again, I'm a klutz.

 

I removed all the other things holding the scuttle in place: heated screen wires, wiper nuts, washer tube, some electrical box velcro'd to the underside, etc.  However, it appears removing it is a two-person job given the various bits that are in the way.  It will either take a lot of simultaneous maneuvering from both sides, or the windscreen needs to come off so the scuttle can flex a bit to the sides and clear everything.  I suspect some cars are easier in this regard given the hand-built nature.  The Westfield, in contrast, is a one-person job.  Unbolt everything and lift straight up.  

 

-John

[toldfield]

Do a search for Strap Duplicator available from Aircraft Spruce, Brown Tool Supply, and other aviation tool places.  

 

[sltous]

15 hours ago, JohnCh said:

If an M4 rivnut will fit in that location, I'm going that route.  The M4 button head diameter is the same as the rivet it replaces, so aesthetically it's a wash, and the M3 heads are a little too easy to strip in my experience.  But then again, I'm a klutz.

 

I removed all the other things holding the scuttle in place: heated screen wires, wiper nuts, washer tube, some electrical box velcro'd to the underside, etc.  However, it appears removing it is a two-person job given the various bits that are in the way.  It will either take a lot of simultaneous maneuvering from both sides, or the windscreen needs to come off so the scuttle can flex a bit to the sides and clear everything.  I suspect some cars are easier in this regard given the hand-built nature.  The Westfield, in contrast, is a one-person job.  Unbolt everything and lift straight up.  

 

-John

It looks like there's plenty of tube wall on my car to drill out for the M4 rivnut.  With respect to removing the scuttle I unbolted my aeroscreen first because I didn't realize the captive nuts it is bolted to could be removed as one piece so you're way ahead of me  

 

It was a bit of a pain to remove all the parts individually (and find clean, safe horizontal storage for everything) but with a little care everything came up easily.

[JohnCh]

Thanks @sltous, @11Budlite confirmed he also removes the windscreen first.  I read in someone's blog they recommend three (no, not a typo) people be on hand to remove the windscreen.  I might take a shot at doing it solo later today.  I think I can stabilize things enough with tape and cardboard that if it proves problematic doing it myself, I can get the windscreen safely back into place without damage.  Famous last words...

 

-John

[IamScotticus]

My advice is loosen the six window frame screws to relieve any tension  or just plan on removing the frame off the stanchions.

Stanchions attached to the frame scratch stuff.

I know.

[JohnCh]

I confirmed that with sufficient blue tape to prevent the windscreen from falling backward and protect the scuttle paint, removing the windscreen is indeed a one-person job.  For anyone doing this in the future, items to remove are:

• 26 rivets at the front of the scuttle, plus 2 more on the sides
• 4 scuttle retaining nuts that attach the scuttle to the chassis tubes
• Windscreen wiper arm nuts
• Windscreen washer tube
• The two screws in the pair of tonneau snaps on the top center of the dash 
• Wiring loom connection box secured by Velcro to the underside of the scuttle near the tonneau snaps
• Two heated screen wires located at either end of the windscreen.  I was unable to remove the grommets, so resorted to cutting off the connectors.  I'll probably replace them with bullet connectors that can slide through the grommet to make that process easier
• The windscreen with stanchions

You will also need a lot of blue tape and a Guinness to steady your nerves.

 

I'll add more pictures in my build thread.

 

-John

[Croc]

John - look at installing the captive nut bracket for the windscreen - makes it even easier to do the windscreen one handed.  There is a left and a right side of these.

 

Retaining Channel - LHS (caterhamparts.co.uk)

 

 

[JohnCh]

Thanks, I'll add those parts to the list.  

[sltous]

Hi John,

 

In the process of re-installing my scuttle and wanted to give you some updated notes.

 

I was able to use every other rivet hole instead of all 24 and it is adequate in terms of structure in my opinion, I am not worried about the scuttle - to - firewall mating surface flexing and causing issues.  Every 4th hole is definitely too far apart.  I haven't tried driving with the current setup yet so I don't know if there will be issues leaving every other hole open, I might consider a spot of caulk or some other kind of seal on the open holes if anything pops up that is annoying.

 

The plastic bolts I initially planned to use are a bit unsatisfactory.  I stripped one installing the first 8 (every 4th starting from the 2nd from the outside I think got me to 8) and switched to some stainless fasteners I had on hand when re-installing with every 2nd hole.  If you are super hardcore about weight savings damn the cost you might consider aluminum bolts or something exotic but to me the tradeoffs for the plastic bolt stopped making sense as soon as I actually tried using them.

 

Using the furthest outward hole may introduce challenges.  I skipped it because my drill couldn't reach  but I also think the rivnut might run into the scuttle and require some surgery

[JohnCh]

Thanks @sltous!  I wondered about those first and last holes.  I didn't have an issue drilling out the rivets in those locations but did wonder if I could drill perpendicular-enough hole for the rivnut.  

 

-John