Yoram Posted January 9 Author Share Posted January 9 (edited) 360S S3 "Yellowjacket" Build - Lessons Learned III Optimal (in my view) Entire Build Sequence (yes, I know, this is a long one) Steering rack Front suspension (incl. headlight stays); leave bushing bolts/nuts snug, do not torque to specs Roll bar (cockpit) Handbrake lever Engine+gearbox install Propshaft and diff Gearbox top-up Diff fill Torque propshaft to diff Rear suspension Rear brakes Steering shaft Radiator Engine wiring and plumbing Plenum+throttle cable Rear bulkhead carpet Shoulder harnesses Tunnel carpets knee trim panels and fuse box cover Rivet interior panels Lap harnesses Rear tunnel plate Tunnel top Brake & clutch system fill Brake bleed Clutch bleed Adjust handbrake Tie down handbrake cables Heater-delete blanking plate* Header pipes and cat Install steering wheel (non-quick-release) Mount wheels, lower onto ground Torque driveshaft nuts Ride height and cross weight setting (in Loaded condition) Torque suspension bushings (in Curb) Ride height and cross weight check (in Loaded) Alignment (in Curb) Jack up back on stands Floor mat retaining studs* Seats Rear wings & lights License plate bracket* and light Washer bottle & fuel filler cover Front wings & repeater lights Headlights & pods Muffler Airbox Fill and charge battery Engine oil fill Engine coolant fill Fuel tank fill Connect fuel line and battery Start-up Center mirror Side mirrors Drop on wheels Nose cone Bonnet Maiden drive TPS setting High-mount center brake light* Lit whip* Trunk trim Custom build plaque* ___________________ * Optional (non-kit) items Edited January 9 by Yoram 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoram Posted January 17 Author Share Posted January 17 (edited) More on Lit Whip This is a follow up to my post here from Dec 18. I received since a replacement fiberglass whip from Buggy Whip and on its own this one works fine. They are good and helpful folks. BTW, a belated thanks to @CharlesG for the Buggy Whip lead! But I discovered a weird situation: When I turn on the lights with the engine off the whip lights up fine. However when I turn on the lights with the engine running, all of them light up fine, including my added high mount center light, but the whip light does not! I suspected it had to do with my separate ground wiring for the whip through the unused fan switch, which proved to be the case. As described in the original post, I ran the positive feed to the whip together with the center mount light from the rear lights loom, but ran the ground wire separately through the fan switch in order to be able to kill the whip if needed while keeping the lights on. (Default is whip works together with lights.) Originally, I cut the original "load" wire of the switch and connected it to the ground wire running from the whip. However, I kept and used the original "ground" wire of the switch which I had verified for continuity with the battery ground post. It appears though that the ground of the switch was fluctuating in voltage with the engine running and as a result depriving the whip of proper 12V. So today I cut also the original "ground" wire of the switch and connected it directly to the battery ground post, and the issue is solved. I drilled a small hole in the rubber plug I had installed to seal the bulkhead hole for the (unused) heater valve cable, and passed the ground wire from the switch to the battery through it. The positive feed to the whip still passes through the lights fuse so it is protected. Cheers! Edited January 17 by Yoram Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoram Posted January 22 Author Share Posted January 22 (edited) Nose Cone Dzus Fasteners -- Conversion to U-Nuts and Screws A few months ago I mentioned my struggles with the nose cone Dzus fasteners. More specifically, with the bottom ones. There seemed to be no way I could engage them. I found the top/side ones were manageable as you can see the slotted pin and guide it to engage the S-spring, but with the bottom ones you cannot see anything. So until a couple days ago I was driving with just the two top/side ones engaged, and the nose cone seemed to stay in place... However I also noted the occasional rattle from it touching the coolant expansion tank cap and in general felt that this needed to be fixed. After some noodling around I decided to keep the top/side connections as is but to convert the bottom ones to U-nuts clamping the chassis tabs and screws inserted from below. I chose 5/16" thread as that matched the Dzus pin OD and therefore the screws would fit well in the existing holes in the nose cone. I cut off the tips of the Dzus pins at the slot with a Dremel tool to remove them, and drilled out the rivets of the S-springs from the chassis tabs (access from underneath). When fitting the U-nuts onto the chassis tabs and trying to insert the screws I found that long U-nuts inserted laterally from the inside work best to get the nuts to reach anywhere to line up with the holes in the nose cone. However, while playing with the U-nuts I also realized that the main reason the bottom Dzus pins would not engage was because the bottom S-springs were located about 1/2" too far forward relative to the nose cone pins with the top/side connections engaged. Of course this condition may be peculiar to my car, but to prevent it from recurring with the U-nut solution I enlarged the holes in the chassis tabs in the aft direction with a Dremel tool, which I later used (with a different implement) also to smooth out the upper and lower faces of the tabs. Before installing the nuts "for real" I touched up the tabs with a chassis paint stick. I also added a large washer between the upper face of the tab and the nut in order to increase the clamping force to help the nut stay in place when removing the nose cone. I chose 5/16" socket hex button head screws, 1" long. The reason for socket hex is that a small Allen key is easy to carry along, and also quite handy to poke in and align the nose cone and nut holes before inserting the screws. Nose cone with Dzus pins removed: Removed Dzus parts per side: U-nut with washer on chassis tab: This is the U-nut you want (Lowe's): 5/16"-18 x 1" button head socket hex screws: I repeated several install and remove "test cycles" and satisfied myself that the solution is reliable and manageable in "field conditions". Best order of fastening is first bottom screws (use allen key to first align holes), then top/side Dzus pins. I certainly like how tight and rigid the nose cone feels now vs. before the fix. Next, I hope to resume my Lessons Learned compilation soon... Cheers! Edited January 22 by Yoram 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdb Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 I too was frustrated trying to latch the bottom fasteners on the nose cone. I replaced the 'coin' style units with 'wing' style that I found on Amazon. They make the task much easier. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01NBYNHMF?th=1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoram Posted January 22 Author Share Posted January 22 (edited) 4 hours ago, wdb said: I too was frustrated trying to latch the bottom fasteners on the nose cone. I replaced the 'coin' style units with 'wing' style that I found on Amazon. They make the task much easier. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01NBYNHMF?th=1 Thank you! Based on what I found out after removing the bottom fasteners they could not engage due to the major misalignment between the cone and the chassis. Also, I use a stubby flat screwdriver and I have no major problem engaging the top ones. Now that I had to move the bottom connections aft (enlarge the holes) it would be difficult to install new S-springs on the tabs (find room for new rivet holes). I get the dimensional error, but it amazes me that Dzus fasteners are the best Caterham (or anybody) could come up with. In my book they should be outlawed... Edited January 22 by Yoram Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoram Posted January 22 Author Share Posted January 22 I added a pic from underneath of the installed screw in the original Dzus fasteners post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anduril3019 Posted January 25 Share Posted January 25 Regarding the lower Dzus fasteners, I'm experimenting with hinges and a tilt up nose. It needs a little finesse, but so far I'm liking it in concept. Part of the trick is getting it to pivot in the right place to clear everything as it swings open, and not have the pivot points hanging below the frame or nose where they are exposed to dirt and damage. The pins are easily removable, so the nose can still be completely removed if needed. The frame half of the hinge will be screwed to the frame. On the top, I can still use the standard Dzus method, or I may try just using small alignment pins and allowing the bonnet to do the hold down work. I'm going to add a clip-on check strap on either side to keep it from hitting the ground when open. I'll probably reinforce the nose at the mounting points. The hinge parts are 16ga. stainless from SendCutSend. Pardon the nose condition, it's a work in progress. It was mostly held together with tape when I got it, and I'm slowly working it back into shape. Anyone recognize it, by chance? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panamericano Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 Nice concept. You may just be inventing something many & owners will want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoram Posted January 27 Author Share Posted January 27 On 1/25/2024 at 6:58 PM, anduril3019 said: Regarding the lower Dzus fasteners, I'm experimenting with hinges and a tilt up nose. It needs a little finesse, but so far I'm liking it in concept. Part of the trick is getting it to pivot in the right place to clear everything as it swings open, and not have the pivot points hanging below the frame or nose where they are exposed to dirt and damage. The pins are easily removable, so the nose can still be completely removed if needed. The frame half of the hinge will be screwed to the frame. On the top, I can still use the standard Dzus method, or I may try just using small alignment pins and allowing the bonnet to do the hold down work. I'm going to add a clip-on check strap on either side to keep it from hitting the ground when open. I'll probably reinforce the nose at the mounting points. The hinge parts are 16ga. stainless from SendCutSend. ...... Excellent!! I was imagining such solution but never got to dive into an actual design and fabrication. Please keep us posted!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamScotticus Posted January 27 Share Posted January 27 Would these work on the bottom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoram Posted January 27 Author Share Posted January 27 2 hours ago, IamScotticus said: Would these work on the bottom? Interesting!! Possibly. I like this; the sliders should fit nicely in the longitudinal recesses on the bottom surface of the nose cone. The only potential challenge I see is that the cone would have to be slid on lowered at the front to clear the pins which would be protruding down from the tabs, and then lifted into position while threading the pins through its holes. That may be a bit tricky. But should be doable. Do you have a link to the source with dimensions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoram Posted January 27 Author Share Posted January 27 (edited) 17 hours ago, IamScotticus said: Would these work on the bottom? The other minor concern I see is that this latch does not clamp the cone against the frame; it will hang down and rest on the land under the head of the pin (the land above the head in installed position, with the pin pointing down). Probably not looser than with the Dzus pins and much easier to engage. Edited January 27 by Yoram clarify Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamScotticus Posted January 28 Share Posted January 28 here https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productdetails.asp?RecID=4660 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoram Posted January 28 Author Share Posted January 28 (edited) 13 hours ago, IamScotticus said: here https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productdetails.asp?RecID=4660 Scott, thank you! This should be a pretty straightforward installation from my current stage - drill out the rivets and remove the pin flanges in the cone, mount these latches instead on the underside of the cone (drill 2 holes, backing washers and pop rivets). Then need a #8 (or M5) screw, washer and locknut to clamp each "bushing" onto the chassis tab; maybe add two fender washers if need to use the existing large hole in the tab. Would take some finagling to get the bushing lined up with the latch and clamped tight in latched position but seems quite doable. I will keep this as the next step if my current screw solution proves too tedious in practice. P.S., the vertical free play I mentioned as a minor concern in my previous reply can be taken out by shims under the latch, so scratch that. Edited January 28 by Yoram Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamScotticus Posted January 28 Share Posted January 28 I think the nose mostly hangs from the top fasteners, and many racers leave the bottom unfastened. I suspect a light clamp is sufficient. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pethier Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 6 hours ago, IamScotticus said: I think the nose mostly hangs from the top fasteners, and many racers leave the bottom unfastened. I suspect a light clamp is sufficient. I think the bonnet essentially holds the top of the nose in-place if the bottom is fastened. I'm not ready to rely on either concept, though: I think I am going to fasten the nose at all four locations. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoram Posted January 29 Author Share Posted January 29 6 hours ago, IamScotticus said: I think the nose mostly hangs from the top fasteners, and many racers leave the bottom unfastened. I suspect a light clamp is sufficient. I think you are right. I have not raced mine yet (and likely never will) but that's how I was driving so far. I noticed though that I could move the tip of the nose up and down a bit with my hand with the top ones fastened. I also noted the occasional rattle of the nose against the expansion tank cap. I like $hit to be tightened down, hence my quest to fix the bottom fasteners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamScotticus Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 yea, also the clamping force from the bonnet across he top and sides. perhaps a skid pkate as well to prevent the nose bottom hooking on something in reverse? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoram Posted January 29 Author Share Posted January 29 (edited) 360S S3 "Yellowjacket" Build - Lessons Learned IV Bolted joints - General Various bolts require anti-seize lubricant (e.g., copper grease) or thread locker, may have difficult wrench (especially torque wrench) access, and/or involve challenges in part alignment. Therefore, as a rule, perform an assembly dry-run first for every joint, before applying lubricants or thread lockers. Front Suspension 1. Lower wishbone Installing the 2nd pair of washers in the lower wishbone rear bushing position is easier if you temporarily install 4-6 washers on the front bushing bolt and partly tighten it so that it pushes the wishbone back and increases the gap for the washers. 2. Upper wishbone/Headlight stay Bushing sleeves: The bushing sleeves for the rear upper bushings in my kit were in the bag labelled "anti-roll-bar". Headlight stay (bracket): Getting the bolt through the second (rear) hole is a struggle. I tried two methods: a) Observe in which direction the rear hole is off and bend the bracket ears accordingly in a vice with smooth aluminum faces to create a "mild trapezoid". Apply the bending by hand on the bracket boss. b) Carefully hammer a conical punch through the rear hole with the bolt partly inserted in the front hole. Mask the body and upper wishbone beforehand to prevent damage. Easier than the previous way. 3. Coil-overs 6” long 6mm male hex bit with spherical tip speeds up upper attachments. 4. Upper ball joints Upper ball joint nut requires an adapter for torque wrench access. Used a stubby two-ended 22mm wrench "extender" engaging the torque wrench via a 22mm male hex bit. Requires to calculate a revised torque setting to account for the added lever length. 5. Anti-roll bar Install both ends first into the cups in the upper wishbones and pull ARB mounts onto the frame using temporary longer M8x1.25 bolts and nuts. Front caliper copper washers Washers supplied with my kit did not fit well -- ID too big, OD too small. Note that ID must fit around the small ridge on the fitting - 10.2mm works well. Used washers from an Amazon-sourced variety pack, 1mm thick, 10.2mm ID, 16.0mm OD, home annealed and pickled. Engine+Gearbox Install 1. Frame protection 22mm ID/32mm OD slit foam sleeves work well to protect frame tubes. Zip-ties are magic for everything. 2. Fastener try-out Try-out fasteners and torquing in all mount subassemblies to the extent possible and figure out necessary adjustments and workarounds ahead of time to minimize surprises and setbacks during actual powertrain install. 3. Powertrain mounts - assembly and tightening Gearbox contact with tunnel: I needed to enlarge laterally the 4 M8 chassis bolt holes in the gearbox mount to alleviate contact with tunnel. This meant supporting the gearbox on a floor jack in position, disassembly of the mount, grinding the holes and re-assembly. Tightening sequence: Start with the gearbox mount - first the two gearbox M14 bolts, then the four M8 chassis bolts. Have a helper bias the gearbox laterally with a padded crowbar against the tunnel to center the gearbox. I used hardened oversize washers + regular washers under the M8 bolt heads (2 per bolt) over the enlarged holes in the mount. Next torque the engine mounts -- first brackets to engine block, then rubber blocks to chassis, then brackets to rubber blocks. 4. Propshaft insertion See post re sequence (Lessons Learned II). Edited February 9 by Yoram added info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoram Posted January 30 Author Share Posted January 30 (edited) A Sunny Winter Drive Several Firsts today. First drive with the nose cone bottom screws instead of Dzus fasteners - all rattling from the front gone! Also first drive with full doors and a balaclava -- much much better. First time on the freeway, and up to, uh, cruising speed... Completely manageable for both wind and temp as well as tracking and yaw stability. Finally, first refueling at a gas station (QT Top Tier 93 Octane). Very slow - quite a bit of blow-back. Ride quality on SC poor secondary roads is quite decent considering I'm sitting smack on top of the rear axle... I am a happy camper. 90 miles on the odometer!! Edited January 30 by Yoram 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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