JohnCh Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 Given your desire to have something that can be serviced easily, you might want to look into the new Westfield Miata. It uses the Miata drivetrain and many of its suspension pieces, so nothing esoteric for those of us on this side of the pond. >Flyin Miata is building one right now and is offering donor pallets and pre-built cars. They also are documenting their build. The cockpit of the Westfield is not quite as big as the SV or Ultralite, but it is far roomier than a standard Caterham or Birkin. Might be worth checking out. Regarding power levels, I think there are two absolutes with these cars: it doesn’t take a lot of power to make them fast, and no matter how much power you have, you will eventually want more. In its first incarnation, my Westfield was full road spec (i.e heavy) and had a 120hp xflow. It was a lot of fun and it was reasonably quick (Road & Track clocked it from 0-60mph in 6.1 seconds). After the rebuild, the weight dropped over 12%, while power increased almost 60% thanks to a 190hp Duratec. Driving the car on a windy road is now a much different experience. With the xflow I could really extend the engine and throw the car around with abandon. With the Duratec, the car gets to the next braking point so damn fast that I often find myself reflexively breaking that commandment about not taking the Lord’s name in vain (oh my G**!!). I also have to be far more careful about when and how hard I apply the throttle. Yet even with this kind of acceleration, I have adjusted to it and now I want more. That’s why there is a 30hp upgrade sitting in my garage at the moment http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/images/emoticons/smile5.gif My advice is to not focus so much on buying a car with a lot of power, but make sure that the platform has room to grow as you adjust and want more. As you will soon discover, upgrades are half the fun! -John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spotcheck Posted February 12, 2007 Author Share Posted February 12, 2007 JohnCh - thanks for your comments. Good point about headroom to grow. I also liked powderbrakes line "no replacement for displacement" - suspect that one has been used before. Top-end speed on a long straight doesn't interest me - its the Oh my G** heading through the curves. My daily driver 528 has only 200HP, but running it at 4,000 - 6,500 makes the curves move by fast. At the same time, I learned a long time ago that I am happier in the end if I have to wait a little longer to get what I really want. I wish I had waited on the BMW to afford the 540, but maybe that's a good thing - that's why I'm looking into the LSIS - the 528 has no problems at all. Curious - 12% weight decrease is 150lb or more ?? - what were key items that let you strip that much out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnCh Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 When I wrote that I rebuilt the car, I mean I really rebuilt the car. I kept the frame, driveshaft, some suspension pieces, and a few other items, but everything else was replaced with lighter items: body, engine, interior, brakes, etc. When the car was in R&T, they weighed it at 1409lb. I don’t know how much fuel was in the car at the time, but I have heard that back then (1996) they would typically weigh the cars with ¼ tank. After the rebuild, the car weighed in at 1238.5lb with a little over ½ tank. Key weight reduction areas included the very lightweight radiator, alloy hubs & 4-pot calipers up front, Duratec with alloy bellhousing, titanium silencer, spare tire removal, stripping out the interior, carbon fiber seats, lightweight battery, etc. A 5 lb reduction may not sound like much, but do that in a few areas and the savings add up quickly. -John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestTexasS2K Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 While agree it is nice to expand on what you have it doesnt seem to make sense to spend alot of money on a motor to drive for a short while. Then turn around and spend another chunk of money on making it faster. IMHO buy it fast and use the right foot to get use to the power. Just because you have 240hp nothing says you have to use it. The one thing about the honda is just keep it under 6k and it drives like a honda civic. Over 6k it turns into another monster. Just my 2C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnCh Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 While agree it is nice to expand on what you have it doesnt seem to make sense to spend alot of money on a motor to drive for a short while. Then turn around and spend another chunk of money on making it faster. I didn't realize I wrote that. I guess I should pay more attention when posting during meetings http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/images/emoticons/wink5.gif To clarify, I don't think that someone who isn't used to a powerful car should obsess about power levels. A lower spec, cheaper engine, is still a lot of fun, and still pretty damn fast. The key is that if they think they want a lot of power in the future, then they should pick a powerplant that has sufficient headroom (e.g. if you think you eventually want over 200hp, then starting with a xflow may not be the best idea http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/images/emoticons/wink5.gif ). -John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slngsht Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 JohnCh - thanks for your comments. Good point about headroom to grow. I also liked powderbrakes line "no replacement for displacement" Never hear of that http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/images/emoticons/wink5.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slngsht Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 We'll get around to having a "New to Se7ens FAQ" some day Yeah, but it's much more fun this way http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/images/emoticons/yesnod.gif It's like a personal FAQ service Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spotcheck Posted February 13, 2007 Author Share Posted February 13, 2007 5 lb reduction may not sound like much, but do that in a few areas and the savings add up quickly. -John You may have found a way to get me more religious about a diet - from 220 back down to 200 would equal a lot of carbon fiber and alloy parts!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderbrake Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 5 lb reduction may not sound like much, but do that in a few areas and the savings add up quickly. -John You may have found a way to get me more religious about a diet - from 220 back down to 200 would equal a lot of carbon fiber and alloy parts!! I'll second that!!! I've been on so many diets over my lifetime, I've lost my whole body weight several times.http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/images/emoticons/cryin.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowss7 Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 Nah, don't bother dieting. You need the weight to get the rear wheels to hook up. http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/images/emoticons/lol.gif Unless you're looking for top end terminal speed on the track, it's not an issue. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spotcheck Posted February 13, 2007 Author Share Posted February 13, 2007 Nah, don't bother dieting. You need the weight to get the rear wheels to hook up. http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/images/emoticons/lol.gif Unless you're looking for top end terminal speed on the track, it's not an issue. Tom Perfect - now give me a solid justification for increased wine consupmtion, and I'm all set. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowss7 Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 How's the old classic... Life's too short to drink cheap wine. http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/images/emoticons/ack2.gif Buy a 7 and you'll bring smiles too everyone you pass, except the M3 drivers. http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/images/emoticons/rofl.gif Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitcat Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Speaking of "headroom to grow", the sky is pretty much the limit with the Flyin Miata turbos. Mid 200's for HP & torque is routine but some of their dyno charts go up to the mid 300's & higher. In a 1300 lb car it would be like strapping yourself to a rocket! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scannon Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Speaking of "headroom to grow", the sky is pretty much the limit with the Flyin Miata turbos. Mid 200's for HP & torque is routine but some of their dyno charts go up to the mid 300's & higher. In a 1300 lb car it would be like strapping yourself to a rocket! 400+ is getting almost common. One dyno sheet I saw showed 606 hp and 500+ torque. The first iteration of my turbo Miata engine will be in the 220 - 240 hp range with similar torque. Eventually I want to do the 2.0 stroker which should bring an easy 320 hp at 12 psi. Skip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spotcheck Posted February 14, 2007 Author Share Posted February 14, 2007 Speaking of "headroom to grow", the sky is pretty much the limit with the Flyin Miata turbos. Mid 200's for HP & torque is routine but some of their dyno charts go up to the mid 300's & higher. In a 1300 lb car it would be like strapping yourself to a rocket! 400+ is getting almost common. One dyno sheet I saw showed 606 hp and 500+ torque. The first iteration of my turbo Miata engine will be in the 220 - 240 hp range with similar torque. Eventually I want to do the 2.0 stroker which should bring an easy 320 hp at 12 psi. Skip GULLLP!! Now you guys are starting to scare me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowss7 Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 That kind of HP is probably only good if you drag race. I doubt very much that you could fit tires wide enough to hook up and as for the Turbo, I doubt that it would give any advantage in an autox. More likely it would be a liabilty. IMHO. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scannon Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 That kind of HP is probably only good if you drag race. I doubt very much that you could fit tires wide enough to hook up and as for the Turbo, I doubt that it would give any advantage in an autox. More likely it would be a liabilty. IMHO. Tom I don't do autocross or drag racing (well, maybe spanking a Vette or something on the street). I do track events and I don't think it will be a problem, the turbo Miata engine is a very controllable engine, not just an on and off switch. I have about 6,000 track miles on my Miata with close to 300 rwhp and it gets out of the corners very well. When I drove the 200 hp Zetec SV at the track, my comment to Ben was that it was fantastic, just needed another 100 hp. Skip scannon2007-02-14 14:40:43 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowss7 Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Skip, Point taken, on the track the extra HP helps overcome the poor aerodynamics. Although you have to have pretty huge ones to keep the pedal down for long with 3-400 hp. http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/images/emoticons/yesnod.gif Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slngsht Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 That kind of HP is probably only good if you drag race. I doubt very much that you could fit tires wide enough to hook up and as for the Turbo, I doubt that it would give any advantage in an autox. More likely it would be a liabilty. IMHO. Tom I don't drag race my car either, and I admit that I would be better off with a less powerful, but lighter car for autox. BUT, with 440 horses on tap, this car is FUN, and THAT's the number one reason I have it. Every time I squeeze the GO pedal at any speed, it puts a grin on my face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowss7 Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Hey! Don't hate me because my car only has 197hp and only weighs 1164 lbs. http://www.usa7s.com/aspnetforum/images/emoticons/rofl.gif I was only trying to reply to the new guy's inquiry as to what to look for in a seven. Just didn't want to scare him off if he didn't go big. Even with a 150 hp these cars will outperform almost anything up to a Porsche Turbo or new Z06. Tomyellowss72007-02-14 16:05:59 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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