Time for a new harness

[Xhilr8n]

Brand new 360R. The composite seat fits me fine but the stock Caterham harness just does not make it.  I’ll be glad to get into a discussion but I learned over on Lotus Talk quite a while back how to set up my seat and harness and roll cage.  Let’s just say that I require 6 point, see no reasonable time to ever use 4 point.  
 

The deal breaker for the stock harness is that it is humorously, devilishly difficult to adjust even when you are not in the seat.  That’s fine for just one person who rarely adjusts anything but just way too big an ask for a passenger.
 

My Elise has a nice Schroth set up, a breeze to adjust.  Old fashioned 3” shoulder belts, my neck protector back in the day worked with it. 
 

I’m thinking another Schroth setup in red for the new 360R, appropriate bolt in hardware incl attachment for sub straps, if I can source such.

 

Any other contenders?   

[CBuff]

I have the Schroth profi II asm set up. Love it. You can run 4 pt set up since they have the asm break away. But I usually just do the full 6.  It’s reasonable adjustable (not a super quick endeavor but manageable).  Since the one I adjust most is the passenger - I actually will move the seat which changes the length of all the belts at once. But the harnesses are fairly easily adjustable.  
 

3” shoulder straps. But still hans compatible.  Dated belts. (Mine they 2029) They do come with bolt in hardware. Mine has the eye bolts with clip in

 

I have leather seats but have a cutout for the crutch strap. 
 

 

https://www.schrothracing.com/item/profi-ii-asm/fia-4-point-asm

 

Schroth distro here in USA thru hms. Evan polisky helped me. But they have a few distro centers around the county. 

 

evan@hmsmotorsport.com

 

I really like them and will get them again

 

 

 

[Xhilr8n]

I believe that’s the setup I have in the track Elise, not sure of what hardware might be needed to secure the sub straps in the 7.  This picture during the transition to full track.

[Xhilr8n]

This picture how we ended up

[Xhilr8n]

Even though the basic composite race seat fits me fine I’m looking to replace them with leather, a lot of that for passenger comfort.  Who other than CBuff has cut such seats for sub straps, as I did with the Elise?  Anything to look out for?

Edited June 18 by Xhilr8n

[11Budlite]

With the standard Caterham seats you can just bring the crutch straps on top of the seat cushion and sit on them. It worked fine for me and I think others have done the same. Just an FYI, I have the lowered floors. Not sure if that would make a difference, but I installed them using pg 149-151 of the assy guide as reference.

[CBuff]

i ordered these. But my installer actually put the eye holds in the floor which works but does create some interference with the bottom of the seat squab.  I may switch it out at some point and would likely change to this hardware if I did it again. (Please do t take this as gospel - defer to the manufacturer). 
 

https://www.schrothracing.com/item/bolt-in-end-fitting-kits/hardware-Harnesses

- this would still use the clip in hardware. Which gives you more flexibility on angles etc but creates more hardware under the seat (which may cause interference ) 

 

or this

https://www.schrothracing.com/item/bolt-in-bracket-(b23c)/hardware-Harnesses

this would direct wrap to it. Still bendable for proper angle. 

[bball7754]

I have the Schroth 6 point for me, and ASM for the passenger.  Consider it the best of both worlds, as passengers (not that I have that many) can be mystified by a 6 point.

 

At on point (sometime in the 90’s) Caterham had two tabs behind the seat that could be used for the sub straps.  My 1998 does not have them, so ended up doubling the sub and lap belts.  And I also just sit on the sub straps.

 

[Xhilr8n]

Well it’s done.  Went full speed on the Scroth set up.  It arrived this morning and I felt more like messing with it than anything else today.  It was pretty much plug and play.

 

My Tillet Academy seats have the threads to receive the bolts from underneath fixed so no chasing the nuts around.  The set of runners I sourced from RMC are same but without the nuts welded.  Now I know and can address that.  Still catching the threads from underneath takes long arms on the exhaust side as well as a good feel for threads.  Not too bad though.

 

 

 

 

 

[Xhilr8n]

Need to point out the main advantage of this set up over the stock Caterham setup.   Adjustability.  I’m certain I never figured out how to abjust the OEM set up with the belts off of the car in my hands.  Adjusting anything while in the seat is a Houdini level achievement.

 

These Schroth are a breeze to adjust while you’re in the car.  Anyone with basic mechanical sense can master it in seconds.  Especially important for our brave passengers.

 

I know all sorts of brands including SCHROTH market a “street safe” 4 point and I guess that’s what most folks use.  I’ve seen and been in enough nice offs at track and I’d have to study a while to remember how many times I’ve been in a good collision.  Seen tires fly up in air, all that. Point is I just can’t feel right without the sub belts.  And in this system they are a cinch to adjust.

 

I’m also aware that without a helmet and HANS and arm restraints we’re still not in a proper “system”.  But best we can do for street driving.

[Slonie]

The silver belts look sharp! I've been lagging on installing crotch belts* for my OEM 4-point harnesses (with buckles that can accept them, a relief). Either that, or just getting the Schroth ASMs and being done with it as this is (so far) a street-driven car.

 

*and at that point, figuring out if I'm doubling up on the lap belt anchors or drilling the floor and installing a plate for the sub belts — @Xhilr8n , I assume these plates went in underneath your floor and secured with those eyebolts for the anti-sub belts?

 

[Xhilr8n]

2 hours ago, Slonie said:

The silver belts look sharp! I've been lagging on installing crotch belts* for my OEM 4-point harnesses (with buckles that can accept them, a relief). Either that, or just getting the Schroth ASMs and being done with it as this is (so far) a street-driven car.

 

*and at that point, figuring out if I'm doubling up on the lap belt anchors or drilling the floor and installing a plate for the sub belts — @Xhilr8n , I assume these plates went in underneath your floor and secured with those eyebolts for the anti-sub belts?

 

 

Yes with a springy “wavy washer” on top of carpet, and another between the floor and backing plate.

 

To my understanding, the ASM (I’ve had it in the Lotus Elise) has one belt with a one time breakaway so your body can rotate and not break your neck so badly.  That’s neat and all but I’m not buying it, without a sub belt the cam is going into your abdomen when your shoulders go forward.  Ouch.

[JohnCh]

10 hours ago, Xhilr8n said:

To my understanding, the ASM (I’ve had it in the Lotus Elise) has one belt with a one time breakaway so your body can rotate and not break your neck so badly.  That’s neat and all but I’m not buying it, without a sub belt the cam is going into your abdomen when your shoulders go forward.  Ouch.

 

The primary purpose of the ASM is to prevent the belts from riding up your abdomen and crushing your organs. The slight rotation you mention allows the pelvis to catch on the lap belt and prevent submarining. It's clearly not the same as 5th and 6th points, but is significantly better than traditional 4-points, and more on par with 3-points. This old video from Schroth illustrates results of various belt designs.

 

 

 

 

[CBuff]

I have had the same thought about the asm.  When I am driving on the street without helmet and Hans I see the value (I guess).  When I am on the track with helmet and Hans I wonder if the asm brings movement into the situation that is not wanted/good.  
 

when my dates expire on the belts I might keep the asm shoulder straps for street and then clip in my new dated (non asm)  belts for track.  And just switch back and forth (they are currently clip and eye so it’s easy enough).  But regardless I still feel more comfortable and secure with the crutch attached. 
 

likely over thinking it all but this would address my thinking without any additional expense since the date codes will expire.  Hopefully I never test these theories as crashing in a caterham sounds risky period.