No info on my 7, can you help?

[YourEconProf]

So, I just bought my first 7 as a non-runner that was in my friend's shop. Right now, pretty much only some word of mouth about the car from shop owner, but no documentation, I can't even find the Caterham plaque. Anything you can tell from the pics, or other pics that maybe I should take or things I should look for would be very helpful. Also, is there anywhere I could find a build manual? The wiring looks like it was done by a 3rd grader, so first priority is rewire and replace ECU with a Megasquirt.

 

What I can tell so far:

Raceline engine, shop owner said it's a 250hp version

Pretty sure it's a live axle. Buddy thinks its a Ford 9" but not 100% sure.

 

Otherwise, any insights or observations are welcomed! It's my first Caterham, coming from Miatas. My hope is to have it out for HPDE this Spring and we'll see where it goes from there.

 

Thanks!

 

Matt.

 

[IamScotticus]

You might have a 1965-1968 S2 Lotus SB 2102-2310.  The clue is on the plaque.

Also the rear seat bulkhead top is a round tube, Lotus or Early Cat.  Someone paneled it.

 

A lot of Caterham parts, it may have been built up from a basket case.

 

The dash and side gussets do look very Caterham.

 

The engine water rail is a Raceline part, but the engine isn't built by Raceline.

 

I would like to see more of the axle and steering rack pedestal. 

 

Is this a threaded bung?

A bung here will be Caterham for the spare tyre bracket.  Maybe not early Cat.

 

The wheels look like TR7, or similar.   Measure the lug nut PCD .  3.75"= Triumph/Austin/Morris. 4.25"=Ford.

 

Edited January 14 by IamScotticus

[YourEconProf]

Thank you for the help. 

BCD is 3.75" all around. 

Found the code on the shock tower of AM 83 27--so early 1983 model.

There is a bung in the back where you mentioned, if by bung, you mean welded nut on the interior frame.

The steering rack is a Caterham.

I'll get pics of the diff and steering rack once the car is on stands; I'm heading out of town for a couple of days and will do it when I get back.

 

 

[JohnCh]

9 hours ago, IamScotticus said:

The engine water rail is a Raceline part, but the engine isn't built by Raceline.

 

Without further evidence, I agree.  Although Raceline does make a 250hp spec Zetec, it is an expensive build that includes lots of head work, larger valves, forged rods and pistons with very high compression, etc.  They aren't very common over here. This doesn't mean it's not that spec, but I'd want some proof.  What ECU is in it now?  It might also be worth pulling the valve cover to see if there are any markings on the cams.  That would give a better idea of what's been done: stock or mild cams, then probably stock internals.  Very aggressive cams, then perhaps there is more done inside.

 

Also, if it is an '83, I believe that is still an Ital axle (others will know).  As I recall those can't take massive amounts of power, which would mean yours might have been swapped to the English axle or that the engine is not heavily modified.  Getting some pics of the diff could help here.  Sounds like a fun project!

[wdb]

2 hours ago, JohnCh said:

Also, if it is an '83, I believe that is still an Ital axle (others will know).  As I recall those can't take massive amounts of power, which would mean yours might have been swapped to the English axle or that the engine is not heavily modified.  Getting some pics of the diff could help here. 

 

My car is a '95 and still has the Ital axle, so that may have been what was in the car originally. OP does mention "Ford 9 inch", which if so does lend itself to the car having been given a HP upgrade. Agreed that pics would help. (If it really is a Ford 9 inch rear, I am dying to find out how those wheels were fitted...) Snap some pics of the transmission while you're under there!

[MV8]

Congrats! Looks like a lot of fun work to sort out in stages. Pictures are not high res so I will guess on some things. I see a few race line components but it being the 250 is unlikely considering what appears to be a remote oil filter system with restrictive hardware store fittings and a highly confusing fuel system. Seems to be a mix match of low pressure carb application components on an efi system. I guess that is a fuel pressure regulator under the ITBs with a gauge on it. What is the range of the gauge? It is possible it is the wrong type of regulator for this system. Return type regulators are much more expensive than traditional types that shut off flow when the set pressure is reached.

 

It looks like the fuel tank has a roll over valve as a vent with no hose, an outlet through a glass carb filter and a return, both through elbow fittings ok with carbs, not with high volume efi.

 

Given it is a seven and tight, I would add a low pressure lift pump next to the tank, put a reservoir efi pump where the remote filter is, run the return into the side of the reservoir, then run the vent/top of the reservoir as a return to the tank. No fuel starvation from cornering. Put an oem type oil filter on the block. I expect the oil lines are brittle if they've seen much use and may not be the right type of hose. At best, it is a oil pressure drop. 

 

Pull the plugs then hand rotate to check for binding and oil the bores if needed to free it up. If there is none, spin it over without plugs and put a towel over the top to see what might fly out and listen. Could also do a cold compression test to get a general idea of the condition and look for cranking oil pressure. Take pics of the cam pulleys to note the adjustment. Trust nothing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[YourEconProf]

MV8, 

Thank you for all of that. I'm planning on finally getting her up on stands on Saturday so I can get under her and start examining things better.

 

Lots of great advice on the fuel system; there are a number of bits & bobs we need to identify on it, but this is a plan, so that's good. Particularly around the tank venting, that's new to me. Simple OEM systems I'm pretty comfortable with, but this...is special. :-) 

 

Luckily, I know that the engine turns; the starter will actually spin it but no spark. Shop owner replaced the coil pack, which didn't help, and then reached out to ECU manufacturer (I'm away on business, I don't remember name, but nothing I've ever heard of) and they pretty much said it was no longer supported and he was on his own. That's why I'm planning to put an Megasquirt 3 on it. It will be my 5th one to install, though first not on a Miata. Also could be bad igniter. Owner didn't check and I haven't either.

 

Keep the suggestions coming! Also anything I could/should look for.

 

I'm in sunny, frigid Minnesota today and tomorrow. More pictures on Friday and Saturday.

 

Matt.

 

[YourEconProf]

ALBUM WITH HIGH RESOLUTION PHOTOS: https://photos.app.goo.gl/6qKo4TBgRanR2VUN6

I'll add photos there too going forward, in case some one want to see them at full resolution.

[IamScotticus]

Early 80s would be Escort axle.  The Itals weren't used until the long cockpit, being an 83, its too early for those.  But being 3.75, you probably got an Ital/Marina anyway.

 

I didn't know Raceline built engines.

Edited January 15 by IamScotticus

[IamScotticus]

No spark, check all grounds, engine to chassis,  alternator housing, distributor housing, if electronic dizzy, then advance plate to housing also (for others).

In 7s  everything can shake loose.  Plug wire crimps, alternator connections, throttle cable, clutch cable at fork, brake R clips .

And then there's corrosion.

Fun times.

Edited January 14 by IamScotticus

[YourEconProf]

Yeah, 35yo Miata’s have actually prepared me for ground searching! 
 

For anyone who wondered, the ECU is by Simple Digital Systems. 

[NSXguy]

Since you have a standalone engine management system, it could be whole host of issues preventing start. Ecu/engine calibration/software, triggers being off, hardware or electrical wiring. If you’ve never done this before and picking up from an “unfinished” project it’ll be a steep learning curve.

 

if your car/chassis is an 83, then it is of the same vintage as mine(confirmed by examining your picture link). Likely started life with a ford Kent 1600 xflow, 4spd box and non ford/ital/marina live axle in the back. The PCD confirms this. 
 

there’s a considerable amount of work already done towards the efi conversion but looks like lots still left. 
 

it may have other changes not readily evident from the photos but at a glance:

-fuel tank is upgraded(good thing given the switch to efi)

-front suspension is heavily changed to allow for camber adjustment. ARB has also been modified as a result

- horizontal engine brace is square stock; should be round. 
- different brake master cylinder setup 

 

lastly, you’ll want to confirm what box and rear end is currently installed. I would hope (expect) that they have been upgraded as the 4spd Type 2 and standard rear likely won’t cope with the output of this engine package at all or for long. 

Edited January 15 by NSXguy

[MV8]

You should start a build topic to keep all your work together and make it easier to follow. The hi-res pics are a big help.

Fuel system.

I see the efi inline fuel pump now next to the tank, trying to self-prime by drawing through about two feet of hose (that does not appear to be designed for suction and probably pinches partially closed) and the glass fuel filter. I expect it is there to act as a "sock" filter that would be at the pickup within the tank. Very restrictive, small surface area by comparison and that much more likely to suck the hose shut.

I see they used blue (higher quality?) hose for the pressure side with black (low pressure carb hose?) from the rail to the regulator and from the pump to the prefilter. I don't see a fuel filter between the pump and rail. The hose needs to be high pressure efi hose between the rail and regulator. I'm not sure what regulator it has but I would not trust a gauge with efi pressure long term. Direct reading fuel pressure gauges should be temporary for checking pressure when needed, especially with ethanol content fuel under 40-60 psi. The port can be plugged when not troubleshooting. Also, it appears the throttle cable has a wire around it (for some reason) that is digging into/rubbing the blue efi hose. Everything is rubbing everywhere, but it was worth mentioning.

For a temp fix, the pump can be moved or an AGS 5/16 nicopp brake line can be bent, cut to barely fit in-between the filter and pump, and slightly flared to eliminate a sharp edge that can cut a sliver of rubber from the inside of the hose, clogging the pump inlet. The hose to splice the line into the pump and filter can be the old non-suction hose since it would not be possible to collapse between the line end and the pump or filter. Cut two inch pieces. The remaining old hose can be split lengthwise to go around the line, zip tie or clamp down if needed, and keep it from rubbing anything. The prefilter to replace the glass one can be any oem type fuel filter for efi or carb (the bigger, the better) with 5/16 barbs. Should have metal lines through the tunnel but I suspect rubber. I'd also move the regulator to the firewall and make a metal line from the front of the rail to the back of the head to reduce the amount of rubber line, running the efi hoses adjacent and parallel back to the regulator. This allows the lines to be metal and clamped down from the tank and pump to the regulator with just a few inches of rubber.

The remote oil filter looks odd to me. Maybe another pic of that with light into the area below it? I'd add a small, piston and spring accumulator to maintain oil pressure when hard cornering on a wet sump.

Cams are not advanced/retarded so that's good for now. Looks like they tried changes to the LSA with the exhaust cam at some point but (imho) intake valve closing adjustment is more important for peak pressure bellow the torque peak, balanced with fuel quality and static compression. Valve clearance would need to be checked with any changes. The timing belt idler pulley is looking a bit rough. A metal idler (with replaceable bearing) would be a better choice. If you measure the width, diameter, and bolt ID, I can make a recommendation.

 

[YourEconProf]

All, thank you so much for you help and advice!

I've created a Build Thread for this adventure: