S3 Chassis w/ lowered floors Vs SV Chassis "try on"/Sit in.

[Walshy7]

First let me briefly introduce myself first. Name is Gavin, but been nicknamed Walshy my entire life (hence the Username).

 

Long term lurker on this forum for best part of 4-5 years now. Closely followed most topics with enthusiasm too. Picking up knowledge trinkets on the way. I've lived precariously through most of all your posts and threads truth be told. Some of you really have exceptional knowledge!

 

Originally I was building a 7 back in 21-22, with Josh over at RMC. (PS. Josh over at Rocky Mountain is one cool dude!).

A badass little project, that unfortunately, due to unforeseen certain circumstances, I had to give up/pass on. Those last 3-4 years have been filled with part time regret, part time enthusiasm to get myself FINALLY into a 7. Funny little story, I very nearly purchased that very build and project recently as this time last year. But, that didn't quite materialize unfortunately.

 

In that timeframe (since 21-22), circumstances got back on track and i've been fortunate to own some badass motors (all aided with technology fortunately/unfortunately ) from BMW M4 comp, McLaren 570 & 720s, 911 (992.1 TS), to now owning a 718 Spyder RS.

I give that brief story because I'm constantly seeking adrenaline, fun, but also most importantly an experience. But, also so for those with advice have an idea of what I'm used to. (Most certainly not to boast or brag). 

I won't ever track the SRS, it's my weekend fun, intoxicating intake sounding lovebug, so I'm looking to add a 7 to the stable, that I can experience fun weekend blats with but, also head to a track a few times of the year. So I want it to be different and unique.

 

I first fell in love with Caterhams when growing up in the UK, the desire to own one hasn't changed either.

 

If you've stayed with me this long. Thank you.

 

NOW, to the purpose of this thread. I'm currently stuck in limbo over the chassis I'm going to be comfortable in. (Last time I had sat in and drove a 7 was the blue/orange stripe 620R at superformance, I test drove that. S3 chassis. I also sat in one of their SV chassis) I passed on that one at the time, because the battery had died in it ON THE TEST DRIVE), but it was so long ago, I can't truly recall of my a)comfortability b) how I was able to drive it, in the pedal box I've also gained a bit in recent years. I like to consider myself of a muscular-ish build, but I'm not convinced thats actually factual moreso skinny fat. (I have self deprecating humor) 6ft, 213-215lbs, waist 34-35 inches, inseam 32-33". feet size 10.

 

 

BUT.. it's not the squeezing in part that bothers me, if I can squeeze in, I'll do it, I can live with that, as will my missus have to, as I have a weekend tourer (SRS) and a Truck (Daily) for all the space I ever need. It's the footwell/pedal box, I have size 10 feet, I consider my feet fairly wide-ish. 

 

I'm fairly confident I'm going to go 420cup, if I can situate myself in an S3 with lowered floors. If it's SV I'm unsure if I will want that little bit extra oomph (620??) given that a). I'm a bit of a porker b) the extra weight of the chassis and c) extra weight of the passenger too. I don't to be unexcited about any lag so to speak.

 

So to my questions.

I currently live in Boca Raton, FL soon to be in Marietta, GA within next month or 2.

 

Is there anybody in those areas have an S3 with lowered floors I could "try on" to sit in?

Does anyone know the width of the pedal box in the S3 chassis?

 

Josh has offered me to try on the chassis in Colorado. My travel schedule for next 6 weeks if fairly intense though, trying to get there in time before locking in changes to build. Orlando (this weekend), New Orleans (following), Atlanta, then Phoenix, then Mcallen Texas Alternatively, if anyone lives in these areas).

 

Many thanks!

 

P.S Happy New Year.

 

 

 

[CBuff]

420 sv non lowered floors with leather seats in New York City. Doesn’t sound like your travels take you up north. 
 

I am smaller on all measurements (not by a ton) and am happy with my choice.  Might have done lowered floors if I did it all again but not so much as to wanting to change it. 
 

There is a 620 about to be for sale here.

 

 

 

[IamScotticus]

Go SV. Don't be so focused on the track performance.  Get a 7 you can enjoy tooling around in.  Comfortably.  That will be your keeper.

 

Super 7 2000

 

Here's your car:

https://caterhamcars.com/us/models/the-range/super-seven-2000?view=article&id=56%3Aconfigurator&catid=9&configuration=%2BBOOPITV%2BBPTPCBL%2BBST%2BCLB%2BCTS%2BDSHPDSS%2BE00%2BFST%2BFWG%2BGS5%2BHHL%2BHTR%2BIC7PP7I%2BINSPINM%2BINTPINCINRPINC%2BISB%2BITTPITV%2BKBT%2BLPO%2BLRSPBLK%2BMCP%2BMINCAOPDCUCAIPSLV%2BN7R%2BNAP%2BNBS%2BNDR%2BNGG%2BNRM%2BNSD%2BNTK%2BPIPPBLK%2BPNBPFYS%2BRAB%2BRBCPGBS%2BS2K%2BSGA%2BSIGCHASSIS%2BSIGHEADLIGHTBOWL%2BSML%2BSRB%2BSRD%2BSTU%2BSWL%2BSZV%2BWLW%2BWST

 

I didn't see a LHD option.

LSD is nice if you can pay for it.  Lowered floors is a personal choice but I would not choose it if you don't need it.  

Edited Thursday at 02:29 AM by IamScotticus

[JohnCh]

@Walshy7, hopefully someone will be along soon with measurements of the pedal box, or better yet, have a car you can try on for size.  In addition to the size difference, the two chassis do drive a little differently.  The SV has a 3" longer wheelbase and is 4" wider.  To me, the S3 feels more like a slalom ski that likes short, quick turns, whereas the SV is more like a GS ski that, while still very agile, is not quite as eager (frenetic?), but is more stable in the higher speed stuff.  I think part of that is psychological given the S3 feels far more intimate, but the SV's longer wheelbase and wider track do factor in.  Neither approach is wrong; it's really down to personal preference.  My preference is the S3 but I went with the SV because I wanted the extra room and bigger fuel tank for touring, and I was doing a number of modifications that would benefit from the extra under-bonnet space.  As for the weight difference benefitting from extra power, Caterham claims a 55 lb delta.  Assuming the power to weight ratio of 420R with a driver, that's only about an 8hp difference.  You can pick up more than that by ordering it with roller barrels.  

 

I took a couple of measurements of the SV footbox.  Not what you asked for, but they might come in handy if someone can provide the S3 dimensions for comparison.  I had to use a tape measure to reach down there so these might be off by ~1/8"

 

Width at the brake and clutch pedals (static):  12.75"

Width at the throttle stop: 9.25"

[bball7754]

IMHO, it’s not really about the size of the pedal box.  Let’s face it, it’s small whether it’s an S3 or SV.  But regardless of which you choose, both feet will fit side by side.😊

 

What it’s really about is the distance between the pedals, right?  The width of the pedal box impacts that, but the question is more how much farther apart are the pedals in an SV.  And, does it matter?

 

Personally, I think as long as you wear appropriate shoes (ie narrow sole) you would be fine in an S3, at least in terms of the pedals.  I wear a 10.5, and have no problems.  But wear narrow sole shoes.

 

The seat space and driving position may be more of an issue.  I’m 5’10” and 170, and an SV feels huge to me.  But that’s why you want to sit in them.😊

[wdb]

6 hours ago, bball7754 said:

 

What it’s really about is the distance between the pedals, right?  The width of the pedal box impacts that, but the question is more how much farther apart are the pedals in an SV.  And, does it matter?

 

 

I have a 1995 S3, 'Imperial' but I'm not sure that makes a difference. If I wanted to really mash the brakes I had to mash the clutch pedal first to make room, otherwise I'd hit both pedals. Size 9.5, on the narrow side, close fitting shoes -- didn't matter, the pedals were just too close together. So I pulled the pivot bolt out and bent them! It's much better now but I still need to bend the throttle pedal a bit more towards the center of the car.

[slowdude]

Welcome!

 

Prepare to sell your porsche, it's going to be a snorefest compared to whichever 7 you choose.

 

I've got an S3, imperial chassis as well.

 

Similar leg proportions: 9.5 size shoe (wide, I've got flippers), inseam 31-32, waist (32). I'm 5'7, so from the bottom down we are close-ish.

 

I had trouble finding the pedals on my first drive (as everyone does with a new vehicle).

Since then, no problems. It's easier to wear driving shoes for the extra peace of mind, but my flippers are still wide. 

 

People with SV's will say go SV. People with S3s will say go S3. Driving an SV after driving my S3, I found the SV felt much larger and I had less space in my lane to enjoy myself. It's all in my head.

 

Trying the car on wont do much I think. To really get it you need 3 or 4 days with a car.

[IamScotticus]

The main reason I suggest a SV (I don't have one) is you had stated that there is an interest in the riding comfort of an afore mentioned " Missus":

"if I can squeeze in, I'll do it, I can live with that, as will my missus have to"

So, have you ever had to sit in an airline seat with a guys shoulder in your cheek for hours?  Yea.  That's an S3.  IF you want a happy Missus, SV!  

The S3 can be your doghouse car, the car you put on- you wear it.  It's intimate, lts all you.

[Croc]

You are buying the car of your dreams.  Make the effort to try on in person and ideally drive.  It may be worth waiting to get to Colorado with a visit to Josh do this properly.  
 

For all the emotion sprouting in the above posts on S3 vs SV, for most drivers, the SV will usually be the faster car in a track environment, despite the weight disadvantage, as the wider track gives a handling advantage of confidence to most drivers.  I participated in the UK test of S3 vs SV vs CSR at Donington and it was eye opening for me.   The SV wide track also softens some of the rear end liveliness that comes from mid-corner bumps.  If you are in the top 5% of drivers then maybe the S3 is for you as you will be able to hustle it quicker in a track environment.  
 

if you are touring longer distances then the SV is better.  If you are looking to slalom some back roads for an hour then the S3.  A lot of the decision comes from thinking about your end use objective.  
 

But if you are looking for spousal approval then good luck.  99% of spouses decide it is not their thing.  They would prefer something with a roof, climate control, and less wind blown hair.  Maybe a Miata or Maserati or Corvette if you want her happy?  Personally, I would ignore her and go for my dream car and keep her happy other ways - a new kitchen, holiday, shoes, or maybe a Dyson vacuum cleaner (like one USA7s forum member did this past Christmas )?    
 

The seven is a bespoke car.  It’s like the tailored suit, custom made for you.   Buy it for yourself.  Debate it all you want here but it will not resolve the fundamental concern.  You MUST try it on for size.  
 

FWIW, with your vital stats I bet you could manage an S3 pedal box with race boots on.  

[CarlB]

Everything Croc said is the way I would go. A plane ticket is cheap insurance, so you are happy with your dream. I am 5 foot 10 inches tall, and my shoes are 11 wide. I do not have any problem in my S3, but you have to have narrow shoes. I do not have lowered floors, and my seat is not all the way back. Having said that, lowered floors would be nice, so you aren't looking out of the top of the windshield.  

[coffee break]

If you want to try a standard floor S3 I'm a little east of Marietta. It's not what you are looking for but a good data point pedal box wise.

[John B]

I’m 6’3, 230, size 12 and have more than enough room in my SV. It’s very comfortable.

 

Here’s a trick I learned from racing Formula Atlantics, which are very tight and have a REALLY small pedal box. Go to a race shop that sells racing shoes, most tracks have one. Keep trying on smaller and smaller size race shoes until you simply can not put them on. I was able to get into size 9’s with my size 12 feet. I couldn’t walk very far at all in them, but they sure facilitated my footwork in the car!
 

Best,

 

John

Edited Friday at 03:54 AM by John B

[32eachtime]

That sounds PAINFUL! 😓 

[speedwagon]

As a person with size 13 feet that actually need a ee width, I don't do heel/toe even in my f150.     But a bubble in the foot well is not that hard to construct.  Fortunately my Superformance S1 accommodates my feet adequately.  But if it didn't there would be a "dogleg" in my side bars.  The customer is always right.  And most of us are not "jockeys".     john

[Vovchandr]

Most of the time I don't enjoy being a modest 5 ft 7. 

 

That is until I get into a Crx, NA Miata or especially an S3 Caterham. Then I feel like my size is rewarded. 

[cobra8214]

Echoing others' advice to try driving one to make your decision, everyone's body and definition of "comfortable" is different. Adding my own experience as a tall, new Seven owner to hopefully convince you.
 

I'm 6 ft 3 and fit comfortably in in my long cockpit S3 with stock leather seats (which add a few inches off the floor and a few inches depth-wise, so I would have even more room in a smaller profile seat. Will be replacing with a poured seat soon).

However, my head clears the rollbar by a few inches even without a helmet. My brother is 6 ft tall and clears the rollbar by even more than I do! Height doesn't really tell the full story since the ratio of everyone's torso length to leg length is different.

I sat in a friend's SV with lowered floors and still didn't clear the roll bar. So, I'm currently getting a custom roll bar fabricated.

 

I am able to drive fine in a pair of old Vans (size 12), but will be getting racing shoes before the weather turns.

[Walshy7]

All very welcome feedback from everyone, really appreciate everyones experience, opinion and views thus far.

Like I mentioned I've got my weekend convertible, which I believe is a truly special car. So, I'm not overly too worried about feeling "snug"/"cramped" in a S3 chassis (if that was the case), it is just making sure I can make the pedals work in the pedal box. But, like some have mentioned I am being cautious/patient on making sure I enjoy the experience too!

 

I remember driving the 620R, S3 lowered floors at Superformance, but it was few too many years ago now, I drove it fine, but I just can't recall/I've forgot what my thoughts were on whether I disliked the pedal box, or if it was just alien to me with how small it was and that at the time it was uncomfortable from what I was used to.

 

I will be "trying on" an SV chassis here on Monday in Florida, and a really kind member here @jimmylukeii has offered me to try and link up to see an S3 chassis in Georgia, when I'm there. Schedules/Availability permitting.

 

The result of either or will allow me to choose between the 420cup or the 620R.

 

Taking on your advice @Croc I will be trying to get out to Colorado to see Josh before my build slot needs to be finalized. I just need to align schedule and and travel commitments. I will be in Phoenix, AZ end of January, for a few days and will try to arrange a brief detour to Colorado, either a) getting there or b) traveling back.

 

I'm truly excited to finally get myself into a 7 that I've longed to do for years now. This group/forum is awesome, and interacting with some private messages, have been incredible.

 

Walshy

[mrwierdwrench]

I understand your concern. I'm flying to Chicago tomorrow to try on, and hopefully finalize, a purchase. I own 2 Europa's that are a tight fit, but are roomy in comparison!

[mrmustang]

On 12/31/2024 at 6:27 PM, Walshy7 said:

First let me briefly introduce myself first. Name is Gavin, but been nicknamed Walshy my entire life (hence the Username).

 

Long term lurker on this forum for best part of 4-5 years now. Closely followed most topics with enthusiasm too. Picking up knowledge trinkets on the way. I've lived precariously through most of all your posts and threads truth be told. Some of you really have exceptional knowledge!

 

Originally I was building a 7 back in 21-22, with Josh over at RMC. (PS. Josh over at Rocky Mountain is one cool dude!).

A badass little project, that unfortunately, due to unforeseen certain circumstances, I had to give up/pass on. Those last 3-4 years have been filled with part time regret, part time enthusiasm to get myself FINALLY into a 7. Funny little story, I very nearly purchased that very build and project recently as this time last year. But, that didn't quite materialize unfortunately.

 

In that timeframe (since 21-22), circumstances got back on track and i've been fortunate to own some badass motors (all aided with technology fortunately/unfortunately ) from BMW M4 comp, McLaren 570 & 720s, 911 (992.1 TS), to now owning a 718 Spyder RS.

I give that brief story because I'm constantly seeking adrenaline, fun, but also most importantly an experience. But, also so for those with advice have an idea of what I'm used to. (Most certainly not to boast or brag). 

I won't ever track the SRS, it's my weekend fun, intoxicating intake sounding lovebug, so I'm looking to add a 7 to the stable, that I can experience fun weekend blats with but, also head to a track a few times of the year. So I want it to be different and unique.

 

I first fell in love with Caterhams when growing up in the UK, the desire to own one hasn't changed either.

 

If you've stayed with me this long. Thank you.

 

NOW, to the purpose of this thread. I'm currently stuck in limbo over the chassis I'm going to be comfortable in. (Last time I had sat in and drove a 7 was the blue/orange stripe 620R at superformance, I test drove that. S3 chassis. I also sat in one of their SV chassis) I passed on that one at the time, because the battery had died in it ON THE TEST DRIVE), but it was so long ago, I can't truly recall of my a)comfortability b) how I was able to drive it, in the pedal box I've also gained a bit in recent years. I like to consider myself of a muscular-ish build, but I'm not convinced thats actually factual moreso skinny fat. (I have self deprecating humor) 6ft, 213-215lbs, waist 34-35 inches, inseam 32-33". feet size 10.

 

 

BUT.. it's not the squeezing in part that bothers me, if I can squeeze in, I'll do it, I can live with that, as will my missus have to, as I have a weekend tourer (SRS) and a Truck (Daily) for all the space I ever need. It's the footwell/pedal box, I have size 10 feet, I consider my feet fairly wide-ish. 

 

I'm fairly confident I'm going to go 420cup, if I can situate myself in an S3 with lowered floors. If it's SV I'm unsure if I will want that little bit extra oomph (620??) given that a). I'm a bit of a porker b) the extra weight of the chassis and c) extra weight of the passenger too. I don't to be unexcited about any lag so to speak.

 

So to my questions.

I currently live in Boca Raton, FL soon to be in Marietta, GA within next month or 2.

 

Is there anybody in those areas have an S3 with lowered floors I could "try on" to sit in?

Does anyone know the width of the pedal box in the S3 chassis?

 

Josh has offered me to try on the chassis in Colorado. My travel schedule for next 6 weeks if fairly intense though, trying to get there in time before locking in changes to build. Orlando (this weekend), New Orleans (following), Atlanta, then Phoenix, then Mcallen Texas Alternatively, if anyone lives in these areas).

 

Many thanks!

 

P.S Happy New Year.

 

 

 

Greenville, SC here with a SV without lowered floors if you want to take a drive up to check how you fit. I can tell you from experience though, that at 6' tall, 34" inseam, and 10.5EEE feet, a standard chassis S3 (with or without a lowered floor) was on the tight side for me, and I had to wear racing shoes to drive comfortably. In the SV, I have my street sneakers on, and there are no issues with footbox room.

 

Bill